EHM The Blue Line

dabo wrote:

duff88 wrote:And hopefully you set it up so a majority of people born in Quebec have french canadian names and only a few elsewhere in Canada do. Maybe have a "Quebec" and a "Canada" names list.

This is already thought of and implemented in the database.

it kinda of ruins the game when you see a weird names "giovanni macdonald" from toronto canada, or popular last names like " Shawn Gretzky"

hopefully your game will avoid this. LOL

dave1927p wrote:it would be cool to have be able to have some type of steriotypes to players based on the country their born. Russians are speedy, and perhaps alittle more selfish for money (in north america) so they have a lower loyalty, some could be extreamly skilled but just doesn't have the consistency and just can't play the north american game etc etc.

that would be kinda hard to do because we know that these steriotypes are constantly changeing which would lead to use being able to customize them our leagues throughout the years.

I kinda like this idea. We could set up some league/region specific templates that reflect player tendencies from those leagues in the various countries. Then when the AI generates a new regen for that league/region it would be weighted to choose from the specific templates rather than the general ones. It's a neat idea.

CeeBee wrote:

duff88 wrote:

dave1927p wrote:Also (offtopic again) it would be nice if names in Canada were split up so we don't get Pascal Després. The amount of french names from out west and ontario in EHM is uncanny lol

And hopefully you set it up so a majority of people born in Quebec have french canadian names and only a few elsewhere in Canada do. Maybe have a "Quebec" and a "Canada" names list.

That would surely be an improvement as outside of Quebec and New Brunswick there just isn't a huge French presence. Also there shouldn't be a ton of English names coming out of Quebec. Maybe 90 -10 French from Quebec and 90-10 English/Euro from the rest of Canada?

nice to see you guys agree. It's kinda funny, i posted the same thing on ootp forums and most of them disagreed. lol

dave1927p wrote:

CeeBee wrote:

duff88 wrote:

And hopefully you set it up so a majority of people born in Quebec have french canadian names and only a few elsewhere in Canada do. Maybe have a "Quebec" and a "Canada" names list.

That would surely be an improvement as outside of Quebec and New Brunswick there just isn't a huge French presence. Also there shouldn't be a ton of English names coming out of Quebec. Maybe 90 -10 French from Quebec and 90-10 English/Euro from the rest of Canada?

nice to see you guys agree. It's kinda funny, i posted the same thing on ootp forums and most of them disagreed. lol

Guess thats why this is the EHM /Dabo's hockey sim site and not OOTP BTW, I hung out on the OOTP site for a bit... I have OOTP10, but I like this site about a million times better , whether it's hockey OR baseball.

I was just thinking if it has not been suggested...

Like in Football Manager you can see attribute improvements on player profile. Can this be possible?

axwel3221 wrote:Like in Football Manager you can see attribute improvements on player profile. Can this be possible?

That is what + and - are for in this screenshot I showed earlier.

To go along with this (showing how the attributes have changed on the player profile), could you have it so that it stores previous attributes? Maybe have it work like stats? I'd like to go to a screen where I can look at a player's development over time. For example, the screen would have all of the attributes listed on the left and then have a column for the 2010-11 season, the 2011-12 season, and the 2012-13 season and then the last column would be the current attributes. Each of the previous season attributes could be captured at the beginning of the season (or at the end of the season if that makes more sense). Right now, I kind of do this in a spreadsheet but it's very time consuming.

bruins72 wrote:To go along with this (showing how the attributes have changed on the player profile), could you have it so that it stores previous attributes? Maybe have it work like stats? I'd like to go to a screen where I can look at a player's development over time. For example, the screen would have all of the attributes listed on the left and then have a column for the 2010-11 season, the 2011-12 season, and the 2012-13 season and then the last column would be the current attributes. Each of the previous season attributes could be captured at the beginning of the season (or at the end of the season if that makes more sense). Right now, I kind of do this in a spreadsheet but it's very time consuming.

FM does it. More on what I suggested, thanks for noting it.

Maybe, will ask the database people.

bruins72 wrote:To go along with this (showing how the attributes have changed on the player profile), could you have it so that it stores previous attributes? Maybe have it work like stats? I'd like to go to a screen where I can look at a player's development over time. For example, the screen would have all of the attributes listed on the left and then have a column for the 2010-11 season, the 2011-12 season, and the 2012-13 season and then the last column would be the current attributes. Each of the previous season attributes could be captured at the beginning of the season (or at the end of the season if that makes more sense). Right now, I kind of do this in a spreadsheet but it's very time consuming.

Maybe you could compare scouting/coach's reports that have been saved for the player over a period of time. Again, would be more realistic, I think, than just viewing a bunch of numbers from some arbitrary intervals of time.

But would be great to have an option to export those reports to a comma-delimited file for further analysis in Excel or OpenOffice.

bruins72 wrote:To go along with this (showing how the attributes have changed on the player profile), could you have it so that it stores previous attributes? Maybe have it work like stats? I'd like to go to a screen where I can look at a player's development over time. For example, the screen would have all of the attributes listed on the left and then have a column for the 2010-11 season, the 2011-12 season, and the 2012-13 season and then the last column would be the current attributes. Each of the previous season attributes could be captured at the beginning of the season (or at the end of the season if that makes more sense). Right now, I kind of do this in a spreadsheet but it's very time consuming.

Now that would be sweet if it could be implemented

ArtVandelay wrote:Maybe you could compare scouting/coach's reports that have been saved for the player over a period of time. Again, would be more realistic, I think, than just viewing a bunch of numbers from some arbitrary intervals of time.

But would be great to have an option to export those reports to a comma-delimited file for further analysis in Excel or OpenOffice.

Yeah, I think scout reports would give a much more realistic feel to the game. Perhaps if you scout a player more than once he can compare the two reports and indicate that progress has been made.

With regards to players on your own roster, perhaps when an attribute improves or regresses the +/- symbol appears for a fixed length of time. Maybe something like a week? This would avoid having to store all of the player's previous attributes as well as his current ones.

I couldn't agree more with ArtVandelay's suggestion for CSV files. EHM's export options are very poor indeed (i.e. plain text or html). With CSV files you can easily do anything you want with the data. I would love to be able to export an entire team or league's player stats and player attributes. Being able to export it would allow you to compare how the players play in DHM with how they play in real life - this in turn would help determine how to tweak the attributes stored in the database so as to help ensure the game is realistic. This is something I'm doing with EHM 2007 at the moment but it is so painstaking because I have to manually enter all of the data - if only there was the ability to export everything to CSV...

ArtVandelay wrote:Yeah, I think scout reports would give a much more realistic feel to the game. Perhaps if you scout a player more than once he can compare the two reports and indicate that progress has been made.

With regards to players on your own roster, perhaps when an attribute improves or regresses the +/- symbol appears for a fixed length of time. Maybe something like a week? This would avoid having to store all of the player's previous attributes as well as his current ones.

I like that better.

archibalduk wrote:I couldn't agree more with ArtVandelay's suggestion for CSV files. EHM's export options are very poor indeed (i.e. plain text or html). With CSV files you can easily do anything you want with the data. I would love to be able to export an entire team or league's player stats and player attributes. Being able to export it would allow you to compare how the players play in DHM with how they play in real life - this in turn would help determine how to tweak the attributes stored in the database so as to help ensure the game is realistic. This is something I'm doing with EHM 2007 at the moment but it is so painstaking because I have to manually enter all of the data - if only there was the ability to export everything to CSV...

SQLite administrator can export an entire table to a comma (or any other character) separated file.

dabo wrote:SQLite administrator can export an entire table to a comma (or any other character) separated file.

Sorry, I meant being able to export the stats and attributes from a saved game.

Well a saved game will be stored in a database as well.

dabo wrote:Well a saved game will be stored in a database as well.

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE how data-driven this game is seeming to be.

ArtVandelay wrote:

dabo wrote:Well a saved game will be stored in a database as well.

I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE how data-driven this game is seeming to be.

I second that! Brilliant!

If we're going to have lots of export options, there's no need to store past attributes in the game itself. If we want to track these things, we can export the data when we want and compare them.

ArtVandelay's comment about Scouting/Coach's reports rather than attributes got me thinking. Could these reports be broken down into "Current" and "Potential"? As many people have talked about already, it would be nice to be able to play with attributes hidden (freeware EHM's "wizard mode"). If we're working exclusively off of scouting/coach reports I'd like to see a section describing their current skills/abilities and another describing what levels their skills/abilities could reach. I hope I'm not straying too far into the "Scouting" topic but it would be interesting to have it broken down like this because depending on your scout's skill's, he could misjudge in two different areas.

how about spliting the strength attribute into two sections: Lower Body and Upper Body

Lower can be leg strength and upper can be core and arm strength?

Instead of having a scouting report give an update on how the player has improved/gotten worse, maybe there could be an update after training camp/year update that simply shows the change. That way it would be automatic and occur once per year.
This could last from the time the player is drafted until the player is no longer considered a prospect, so maybe 18-23 or something like that?

dabo wrote:

A9L3E wrote:I think you should take all the names from EHM atleast. And also, I suggest that you wouldn't categorize names according to countries, but according to languages. That's how you would easily avoid wrong languages in wrong regions.

Right now the format of a name in the database is the following:

Nation
State (or region, you get the idea)
Name
Frequency

A rough example:

Nation : Canada
State : Quebec
Name : Francois
Frequency : 30 (on a scale from 1-100)

Nation : Canada
State : Manitoba
Name : Francois
Frequency : 3

This is just made up, but this is basically the idea. Then if you don't enter any state, the frequency of a name will be applied for the entire country. So countries other than Canada and USA will not use this, although you could since there are provinces in other countries as well. Ahh well, I may use it for other countries in the future.

Suggestions/comments are welcome.

Sorry for crashing old topics, but I felt compelled by this one

I think it'd be both more efficient and more realistic to classify names by "ethnicity" rather than by region/country or even language. In the above exemple, you have to attribute a value for people named François in Québec, in Manitoba, and eventually in every other province - then the same for every other name - that makes the database unnecessarily heavy. Rather, you can have a French Canadian nameset and an English Canadian nameset, and finely adjust the amount of each is to be generated in each province. Ultimately it'd allow for finer details, such as splitting the French Canadian nameset into a Québec nameset and an Acadian nameset for instance, or the German nameset into a German nameset and an Austrian nameset. It'd also allow for border regions of countries or very multicultural areas to use various namesets (Japanese, Chinese, Italian...) rendering more accurate results.

As for the frequency of names, how would it work? As a percentage??

-YZG

That makes a lot of sense, YZG.

I agree, sounds like a great suggestion.

So for example in Quebec we could have the following:

FrenchCanadian nameset with a probability of 80%
EnglishCanadian nameset with a probability of 20%

In the real world there are probably other languages spoken in Quebec too but I think that is not very important in the hockey world. The actual percentages used in the game as well as the total number of namesets for each state/province will be determined by the person populating the database i.e. not me.

If this is ok I will make the necessary changes in the database asap.

dabo wrote:I agree, sounds like a great suggestion.

So for example in Quebec we could have the following:

FrenchCanadian nameset with a probability of 80%
EnglishCanadian nameset with a probability of 20%

In the real world there are probably other languages spoken in Quebec too but I think that is not very important in the hockey world. The actual percentages used in the game as well as the total number of namesets for each state/province will be determined by the person populating the database i.e. not me.

If this is ok I will make the necessary changes in the database asap.

Sounds perfect.

Provinces/states/oblasts/län/whatever else will themselves be database entries like the players and everything and not hardcoded, right?

I have big plans for the linguistic and geopolitical aspects of the db if I get to stick my nose in it

- YZG

There are nations, states (= provinces etc.), cities (towns etc.), languages... for example it is reasonable to think that someone who knows swedish fluently understands basic norwegian and danish.

I have big plans for the linguistic and geopolitical aspects of the db if I get to stick my nose in it

Something else you want other than what has been mentioned in the past?