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NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 3:46 pm
by nino33
I've always wondered if NHL Team Budgets should be higher.....after doing some data review/testing, now I'm not so sure HaHa

A few things have become apparent
  • the game changes/increases Team Budgets from their database values at startup
  • Team Budgets increase on their own ingame
  • With the current modern database/Salary Cap, Team Budgets max out at $85.67 million, and eventually all NHL teams have the same Team Budget



First, before looking at my most recent testing using TBL 8.2, I'll repost my look at the 1998 database.
When tweaking the 1998 database recently (for use in the current TBL Challenge) I raised the Team Budgets, but then wrote
nino33 wrote:I think Team Budgets are likely to high; I went with 10% above team salaries (the entire team) and probably should have just gone with team salaries, or maybe 1% higher (Riz did say Team Budget is meant to cover all player salaries, not just those on the NHL roster, but maybe it's not optimally working)
When CJ asked "What's happening in the DB now when you think they're too high?" I responded with the following
nino33 wrote:The current Challenge was the first indication (where the Challenge Rules set the Blackhawks Team Budget much lower than the ingame Blackhawks Team Budget).

I got curious, so looked at all NHL Team Budgets at startup and five years later and a few increase at startup and many increase quite a bit on their own ingame (below is a list showing the increases from 1998-2003).....looking at the list it makes me think maybe things aren't working optimally (I wouldn't think Team Budget should be more than double the salaries of the NHL roster!)

When available, Archi's new editor should allow for adjustments to salary ranges that I'd think should help address this (see third screenshot from his September 24th post http://www.ehmtheblueline.com/forums/vi ... &start=225)


TEAM NAME AVG CLUB SALARY (CURRENT PLAYER BUDGET, STARTUP PLAYER BUDGET)
Blackhawks $22.8 (current $57.59, startup $47.48)
Bruins $29.3 (current $54.32, startup $35.73)
Sabres $27.6 (current $56.83, startup $39.90)
Flames $33.2 (current $57.59, startup $30.57)
Hurricanes $37.5 (current $57.59, startup $40.97)
Avalanche $46.1 (current $57.59, startup $45.41)
Blue Jackets $25.2 (current $51.83, startup $42.36 and not $19.2 as in the database)
Stars $37.9 (current $57.59, startup $52.74)
Red Wings $39.6 (current $57.59, startup $53.28)
Oilers $35.9 (current $57.59, startup $33.95)
Panthers $37.7 (current $57.59, startup $41.53)
Kings $36.8 (current $57.59, startup $42.89)
Mighty Ducks $44.5 (current $57.59, startup $40.25)
Wild $31.4 (current $54.65, startup $40.47 and not $15.30 as in the database)
Canadiens $45.8 (current $57.59, startup $47.36)
Predators $34.8 (current $56.83, startup $21.21 – same as in the database)
Devils $40.8 (current $57.59, startup $40.60)
Islanders $34.3 (current $57.59, startup $34.36)
Rangers $40.8 (current $57.59, startup $51.80)
Senators $42.2 (current $57.59, startup $31.49)
Flyers $44.8 (current $57.59, startup $52.88)
Coyotes $35.3 (current $57.59, startup $42.47)
Penguins $42.2 (current $57.59, startup $43.6 and not $40.91 as in the database)
Sharks $34.5 (current $57.59, startup $42.68)
Blues $43.0 (current $57.59, startup $45.65)
Lightning $35.0 (current $57.59, startup $33.73)
Maple Leafs $46.0 (current $57.59, startup $49.82)
Canucks $36.4 (current $57.59, startup $52.47)
Capitals $37.8 (current $57.59, startup $42.21)
Jets $28.7 (current $54.37, startup $41.99 and not $16.7 as in the database)

NOTE – The Blue Jackets, Wild and Jets all start with just 9 players. Pittsburgh is the only team that starts with a negative Balance (negative $3,901,268 at startup, negative $4,000,000 in the database). Salary Cap is $48.00 million, there is no Salary Floor




In recent days I used TBL 8.2 to do a couple tests and looking at modern/current NHL Team Budgets.
In the following chart, black font = database values, red font = test with database values, and blue font = test with "0" set for Team Budgets and Cash. With the red/blue fonts, the first number is the value at startup, and the second number is the value 5 years later.
Image

I simmed both tests two years further and looked at the results, and all NHL teams had $85.67 for Team Budget.

NOTE - The startup values in the test with the database values (black font) are not a combination of Team Budgets and Cash

FYI - I've emailed Riz, noted the results, and linked this thread

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 4:27 pm
by nino33
I just took a quick look at the year-by-year increases of 7 NHL teams (using the test with the TBL 8.2 values)...here's the results

TEAM - STARTUP - AFTER 1 YEAR - AFTER 2 YEARS - AFTER 3 YEARS
Ducks - 62.44 - 71.27 - 81.27 - 85.67
Coyotes - 58.07 - 71.27 - 81.27 - 85.67
Bruins - 70.04 - 71.27 - 81.27 - 85.67
Sabres - 66.44 - 71.27 - 81.27 - 85.67
Flames - 58.44 - 71.27 - 81.27 - 85.67
Hurricanes - 82.99 - 71.27 - 79.76 - 84.76
Blackhawks - 76.99 - 85.67 - 85.67 - 85.67

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 6:26 pm
by Alessandro
Well, your test is very interesting, but frankly, this should consider other leagues too maybe

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 7:16 pm
by nino33
Alessandro wrote:Well, your test is very interesting, but frankly, this should consider other leagues too maybe
Nobody's stopping you from doing so :-)

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:13 pm
by Manimal
Interesting...
We definately need to hear what Riz has to say about it.

Like Alessandro, I wonder if it is the same with all leagues, but the NHL needs to be the priority to look at of course

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 8:48 pm
by archibalduk
Very interesting. I wonder what effect editing the Finances table will have once this is editable.

Nice handwriting btw! My handwriting is hideous! :-D

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:23 pm
by nino33
Manimal wrote:Like Alessandro, I wonder if it is the same with all leagues, but the NHL needs to be the priority to look at of course
I think TBLer Shindigs has looked at Sweden some (and IIRC it didn't seem the same/teams didn't end up with the same Team Budgets after a few years); maybe Shindigs will see this and chime in

archibalduk wrote:Nice handwriting btw!
Thank you :oops:

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 9:57 pm
by Alessandro
nino33 wrote:
Alessandro wrote:Well, your test is very interesting, but frankly, this should consider other leagues too maybe
Nobody's stopping you from doing so :-)
Time does ](*,) :help:

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Tue Oct 25, 2016 10:09 pm
by nino33
Alessandro wrote:
nino33 wrote:
Alessandro wrote:Well, your test is very interesting, but frankly, this should consider other leagues too maybe
Nobody's stopping you from doing so :-)
Time does ](*,) :help:
Me too, so I prioritize and usually focus on what benefits the vast majority of the community, and also what interest me (like historical) :-)


But I understand the time issue, as I have less and less of it to devote to EHM myself (as I do other things)...everything we all do is better than not doing anything! It's a pretty good game/pretty good community


The EHM Assistant will give the Team Budget/Cash values; if one uses the EHM Assistant to spit out the data it really reduces the time required to compile the data! I admit, I didn't think of using the EHM Assistant to help me compile the data until I was almost done what I posted HaHa

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 11:50 am
by Alessandro
Nino - can you upload this save on dropbox or similar services?

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 12:01 pm
by nino33
Alessandro wrote:Nino - can you upload this save on dropbox or similar services?
There's two tests, one regular 8.2 and one with Team Budgets/Cash set to "0" in the database.....and what exactly are you looking for? Each test has 7 years of saves including startup

I could also export the Team Budget/Cash data using the EHM Assistant and email it to you (I'd need to know what exactly are you looking for/what saves you wanted)

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 2:45 pm
by Alessandro
nino33 wrote:
Alessandro wrote:Nino - can you upload this save on dropbox or similar services?
There's two tests, one regular 8.2 and one with Team Budgets/Cash set to "0" in the database.....and what exactly are you looking for? Each test has 7 years of saves including startup

I could also export the Team Budget/Cash data using the EHM Assistant and email it to you (I'd need to know what exactly are you looking for/what saves you wanted)
I guess you set zero just for the NHL, therefore, I only need data for KHL after 7 years. Can you extract data from startup for KHL budgets and after year 7?

Re: NHL Team Budgets

Posted: Wed Oct 26, 2016 4:05 pm
by nino33
I just emailed you four spreadsheets covering the KHL
  • two covering startup and after 7 years using the 8.2 database
  • two covering startup and after 7 years using the 8.2 database but with Team Budgets/Cash first edited to "0" in the database
EDIT - Oops! :oops: You're right, I did just set the NHL to "0" so the two "KHL startup" & two "KHL after 7 years" spreadsheets I sent you will be the same