1974/75: Nino's Rosters - Mario Lemieux as an 8 year old

[nino33]

Here's a step-by-step regarding using the Updater for adding player history/stats (I think I've got it right Arch)...



When you open the Updater you'll see the screen below...click 6 (Staff career history) and then Enter....in seconds the Updater has compiled the data and you will then be directed to hit Enter to close the Updater




You will then be able to open the csv file the Updater created, and it will look like this...I added the font colour just to to show things better
This spreadshheet is showing what's already in the database! You can "delete" all of these stats, as you just need the headers to "add" player history



I picked Reg Bechtold, from the AHL's Baltimore Clippers...



( FYO Looks like I've exceeded the pic limit for a single post)

[nino33]

You can copy/paste directly from the hockeydb site by pasting starting in the Year column…
I can copy eveything at once (notice how initially I can have years of stats beyond 1974)




The next step is to “clean things up a bit”
- Delete all history from 1974-75 forward
- Regular season/playoffs are on the same line of data, and they each need their own line…so I copy/paste each such line and then delete the extra info so ONLY regular season shows on one line and ONLY playoffs show on another (and add "Yes" to the Playoff Column as applicable)
- As you can see, I also deleted the "--" lines that the hockeydb site uses




Then the “final steps” are to add in Player Name/DOB and change the Years (so 1973-74 becomes 2005, 1972-73 becomes 2004, etc)





Regards

[XenHL]

Also: re: Updater: maaaaaan, this is mindblowingly boggling...

Can I help explain things? Let me know what the problem is and I can post examples, etc.

Well, now that I actually opened it up, I'm pretty sure I've figured it out - it's easy. I posted that after just having been reading the readme, and that was pretty opaque to my cognitive abilities!

[nino33]

Well, now that I actually opened it up, I'm pretty sure I've figured it out - it's easy. I posted that after just having been reading the readme, and that was pretty opaque to my cognitive abilities!

I've had some challenges with the read me too! (the missing "example files" I think would help Arch)

[XenHL]

Here's a question... if a player is playing in the minors but contracted to an NHL team, are those stats considered "on loan" stats?

EDIT: For the record, to avoid duplication of efforts, I've started by working on the Phoenix Roadrunners and Quebec Nordiques, with (of course) Dennis Sobchuk being the first one I entered.

[nino33]

if a player is playing in the minors but contracted to an NHL team, are those stats considered "on loan" stats?

My understanding is no, this is not "on loan" - as far as I understand it's only modern European/Russian Leagues/Players that this "on loan" status really applies to, and so I suspect for the 1974 database this will never/rarely come up



In Real Life back in the mid 1970s NHL players were actually sometimes "on loan" because back then teams often shared affiliations and/or didn't have an affiliation!!!

Back then the 8-12 teams in the AHL were considered the top tier of Minor Pro, and everything else was well below it...it was less about the team you played for, more about the league you were in (that let a player know where he was developmentally) + with most players were at/around age 20 when drafted by an NHL team, and with the WHA offering "competition for players" between 1972-1979 "the minors were a little different" in the 1970s...

For the record, to avoid duplication of efforts, I've started by working on the Phoenix Roadrunners and Quebec Nordiques

Keep in mind most NHL contracted players have their NHL and WHA stats already entered (just their NHL/WHA stats), so when doing NHL players you'll want to maybe check first to see what's already been done...

[XenHL]

For the record, to avoid duplication of efforts, I've started by working on the Phoenix Roadrunners and Quebec Nordiques

Keep in mind most NHL contracted players have their NHL and WHA stats already entered (just their NHL/WHA stats), so when doing NHL players you'll want to maybe check first to see what's already been done...

What I did was to export the list, then went through that, removing all irrelevant players' entries. For the players contracted to the Nordiques and the Roadrunners, I kept all their entries in the spreadsheet, and am filling out all the missing stats.

A question that just came up: for RL OHA I've been entering OHL, and for the Central Professional Hockey League I've been entering Central Hockey League, but what to do with a league like the Eastern Professional Hockey League? Eastern Hockey League is in the DB, as is ECHL of course... should I leave this blank, or consider the EPHL to be the EHL, or?

[XenHL]

And one more question: for the WCHL (Junior) league I intend to enter as Western Hockey League; how about, though, for the old professional Western Hockey League? Should that be entered as the Western Professional Hockey League that's in the DB?

[nino33]

question that just came up: for RL OHA I've been entering OHL, and for the Central Professional Hockey League I've been entering Central Hockey League, but what to do with a league like the Eastern Professional Hockey League? Eastern Hockey League is in the DB, as is ECHL of course... should I leave this blank, or consider the EPHL to be the EHL, or?

Any Team/League name used that's not already in the database causes problems/errors...ideally we'd just do it historically accurate, and you'd tell me what Team/League names need to be added to the database - with all the needed Teams/Leagues in the db I could then add history/stats without issue

Unless there are cases where two or more Teams/Leagues have exactly the same name, I think we'd be OK...

Otherwise I do the update on a copy of the database first to produce the errors file, and then I go through and determine all the errors and fix them (NOT my preference! HaHa)

[nino33]

Unless there are cases where two or more Teams/Leagues have exactly the same name, I think we'd be OK...

And one more question: for the WCHL (Junior) league I intend to enter as Western Hockey League; how about, though, for the old professional Western Hockey League? Should that be entered as the Western Professional Hockey League that's in the DB?

Didn't take you long to find an oddity! HaHa
I agree with using the WHL throughout for the Major Junior League...

I think I could probably have two Leagues with the same name, as the db could differentiate via "Professional" and "Amateur" League…
BUT given this (I don't think) will come up much, the safest approach is probably best (to avoid potential db crashes/issues)...I can add "Western Professional Hockey League" as a defunct League...

Does anyone know if I can safely have two Leagues with the same name if one is Pro and one is Amateur)?

[XenHL]

And one more thought, re: goalie stats. I've found that it may be that there is only stats available for GP and GA, but no minutes; but then the game will add the GA to the rest, but add "0" to the other minutes stats, and then calculate things, and you'll get a skewed result. In a case like this, what should I do? Omit the GA stat, or assume 60 minutes played per game?

[XenHL]

I can add "Western Professional Hockey League" as a defunct League...

You wouldn't have to add it - it's already in there!

I assume that the original devs added that, as a means to make exactly the distinction we're looking at making here.

[XenHL]

question that just came up: for RL OHA I've been entering OHL, and for the Central Professional Hockey League I've been entering Central Hockey League, but what to do with a league like the Eastern Professional Hockey League? Eastern Hockey League is in the DB, as is ECHL of course... should I leave this blank, or consider the EPHL to be the EHL, or?

Any Team/League name used that's not already in the database causes problems/errors...ideally we'd just do it historically accurate, and you'd tell me what Team/League names need to be added to the database - with all the needed Teams/Leagues in the db I could then add history/stats without issue

Well, reason I went with those, like e.g. CPHL entered as CHL, is that they're the same league - just the name changed. EPHL, though, as far as I can tell, just went defunct... that's so far the only one I've found like that so far that isn't already in the DB (like, the Southern Hockey League IS in the DB, so it's not an issue)... but I'm keeping track of defunct teams not in the DB and defunct leagues, too, so I'll be able to tell you those, because I have been adding them into the spreadsheet (the teams, anyways).

There's only one other league that I've left blank so far - that's the one for the University of Denver... its conference isn't in the DB, but along with EPHL I'll add the Western Collegiate Hockey Association to the list of leagues you'll need to add to the DB...

[nino33]

And one more thought, re: goalie stats. I've found that it may be that there is only stats available for GP and GA, but no minutes; but then the game will add the GA to the rest, but add "0" to the other minutes stats, and then calculate things, and you'll get a skewed result. In a case like this, what should I do? Omit the GA stat, or assume 60 minutes played per game?

When you get GP and GA do they also give GAA? Then you'd be able to determine Minutes Played...
Otherwise...I guess assume 60 minutes played per game, so at least we'd have an average
Could you keep track of who this applies to? I have a lot of reference material "on paper", and might be able to find missing data...

but I'm keeping track of defunct teams not in the DB and defunct leagues

Fantastic! Awesome! That'll help a lot

[XenHL]

And one more thought, re: goalie stats. I've found that it may be that there is only stats available for GP and GA, but no minutes; but then the game will add the GA to the rest, but add "0" to the other minutes stats, and then calculate things, and you'll get a skewed result. In a case like this, what should I do? Omit the GA stat, or assume 60 minutes played per game?

When you get GP and GA do they also give GAA? Then you'd be able to determine Minutes Played...
Otherwise...I guess assume 60 minutes played per game, so at least we'd have an average
Could you keep track of who this applies to? I have a lot of reference material "on paper", and might be able to find missing data...

Okay - I've marked the calculated minutes with a * so I know it's an extrapolated number (so far it's only Jack McCartan, he's the first goalie I've reached, but definitely I'm keeping track!).

Quick check, yeah, the GAA is there when GP and GA are given without minutes played... just need to formulate the equation (defining the equation from a word problem was never my strength, though I can do the arithmetic itself without a problem!)

but I'm keeping track of defunct teams not in the DB and defunct leagues

Fantastic! Awesome! That'll help a lot

Re that, I realised the Western Collegiate league doesn't need to be added - the DB dumps it into "United States College West".

[nino33]

Okay - I've marked the calculated minutes with a * so I know it's an extrapolated number (so far it's only Jack McCartan

The site hockeyreference might have missing MP (seems to for McCartan) http://www.hockey-reference.com/players ... rja01.html

[nino33]

SERGEI TOMAS IVAN COACH PETER ULF TIMO are first names I've encountered. The last name POSPISIL, too

Anyone every successfully edited names?

I've been trying for awhile now using the PreGame Editor, and it never seems to actually work (FYI I've been selecting "Allow editing of Forenames/Surnames" from Tools)

I just tried to change AleX to Alex, and ALEXANDER to Alexander but no success...

[archibalduk]

A couple of points regarding the history updating via the Updater:

- I'd be really interested to know how the readme is confusing/unclear. As I understand how the Updater works, it is difficult for me to evaluate the readme. What I have been planning to do is a series of walkthroughs (similar to what Nino posted above) - perhaps this will help.

- Unfortunately I missed out the template/sample files with the most recent version of the Updater. However, you can grab the templates here: https://skydrive.live.com/redir?resid=B ... B049FF!141 (but don't use the version of the Updater included in the zip because it's old now). A planned feature for a future version of the Updater is for it to generate new blank templates from within the Updater itself.

- Note that the Updater cannot be used to correct existing data in the database (well, unless you first delete your existing staff_history.dat file - but I'm guessing you really don't want to do this). It can only be used to add additional data. So if you already have a 1985 entry for Gretzky, and you try to add a corrected 1985 entry in a new csv file, you will end up with two 1985 entries in the game (however, there is an option in the Updater that will help tidy up/remove duplication).

- Make sure the competition and team names you enter into the csv file match those in the database. You can use option numbers 7 and 18 in the Updater to create lists of teams and competitions. The easiest way to correct things is probably to first copy and paste all of your stats into the csv file from HockeyDB, etc - then once you have done all of this, you can tidy up the team and competition names accordingly.

[nino33]

I'd be really interested to know how the readme is confusing/unclear.

Unfortunately I missed out the template/sample files with the most recent version of the Updater

For me it was pretty much all about the lack of templates/samples (i.e. when I was updating contracts)...perhaps an image or two in the ReadMe sections may help visual learners (like me!) "picture" what they're reading about

Make sure the competition and team names you enter into the csv file match those in the database.

Or (as we're doing) let me know of any missing/needed team/competition names, and I'll add them to the db!


Regards

[nino33]

SERGEI TOMAS IVAN COACH PETER ULF TIMO are first names I've encountered. The last name POSPISIL, too

Anyone every successfully edited names?

I've been trying for awhile now using the PreGame Editor, and it never seems to actually work (FYI I've been selecting "Allow editing of Forenames/Surnames" from Tools)

I just tried to change AleX to Alex, and ALEXANDER to Alexander but no success...

I think I got it working, but I can only do one at a time - To do a single change I have to load the db into Editor, select "Allow editing..." via tools, make the edit, Confirm, Save, and the close/shut-down the Editor

[XenHL]

That sounds like it'd take forever and a day...

[nino33]

That sounds like it'd take forever and a day...

It's tedious! So far I've gone through A-J of the Forenames...

[XenHL]

I've just finished the Nordiques and the Roadrunners. Took all day... now I'm going to eat something, and then actually play the game for a while!

I'll email you the csv file and the list of defunct teams and leagues that need to be added.

Something that might be an idea, if several of us are working on this: make a tally here of who's working on what, so that we don't needlessly duplicate efforts?

[nino33]

I'll email you the csv file and the list of defunct teams and leagues that need to be added.

Sounds good!

Something that might be an idea, if several of us are working on this: make a tally here of who's working on what, so that we don't needlessly duplicate efforts?

Good idea; I started a new thread http://www.ehmtheblueline.com/forums/vi ... =13&t=9936

[archibalduk]

That sounds like it'd take forever and a day...

It's tedious! So far I've gone through A-J of the Forenames...

I'm fairly sure that you can edit as many names as you like in one go. I'm almost certain I did this when helping to fix the names earlier this year. It's just that the names list takes a few moments to update in the left hand column once you have made a change and clicked on Confirm.