Challenge #37 Discussion - Blowing Up The Canucks!

[m0fownz0r]

Hmm.. there seems to be a problem with my stats upload. I'm pretty confident I did already upload my stats for Q2,however it shows: Team Stats • Total as of 40 games.

I don't think there is a way to calculate Q2 and Q3 results now that I'm on game 62/3, is htere?

[sao.phim]

Hmm, that is strange. So, maybe just calculate your stats for Q2 retroactively and upload them in Q3?

[sao.phim]

visualdarkness:

Please, do not take it personaly, but your not so good results must come from your line or personal tactics. On the paper your roster looks not so bad. Goals against - 333 - that is way too much, you have also horrendous +/- stats.
What type of forecheck, puck pressure and mentality do you use mostly?
How about aggressiveness? You have 1181 PIM. If I were you, I would try to lower it.

[visualdarkness]

One thing i have noticed is that most young players are let go to RFA by the AI teams wich makes game less fun as we cant trade for players over 24.
I am in dec 2017 and checking the draft list from 2016 show me that only 9 of the top 21 players got a contact. 12 dont have a contract from the top prospects. They are 19 and next year turning 20.

You other managers that are in seson 4-5, does this gets better? couse i think i see a pattern that the prospects with low potential gets ignored by the AI and no contract.

Same here, they are always out of contract until the start of the season and most promising goalies goes abroad.

[visualdarkness]

I'm trying to trade away players at the moment but nobody want my players, I get at best 3-4th round picks for them. Dunno how you guys get 1st liners back for your guys? Though my guys reputation is probably ruined by their performance.

How to trade away bonino for example :

1. play him top 2 lines and make him perform with your best wingers.
2. wait to other teams is interested in him in information.
3. go to trade center and check other teams needs, most teams need keepers but a few needs a top two center
4. a good time to do this is after july1, as some teams release their current centers and thus have a huge gap at center position wich raise your centers value
5. in jan-feb before trading deadline some players are blocked and sometimes a good young player have alot of rumours to get traded away, sometimes that means hes team doesnt value him so high and he can be traded for. I was very close getting jaden schwartz from blues that way, they liked my offer but accepted another offer..
6. sometimes 20-21 year olds gets sent to junior teams, very often they get rated 3 stars and are easy to get.
7 make a shortlist of your top wanted listed and check their value every 3-4 weeks by open trade window of em and guage intrest for trades u wanna do.
8 a way can be to trade for 23-24 year old players with expering contracts after window opens before the draft, they useally have lower value.

whut not to do.
1. trade for stud prospects right after they signed.
2. trade for stud prospects who perform good in nhl or ahl
3. trade for young top 2 liners
4. try to stack many assets for one, useally their is a big penalty for that and each added asset only increase value little of your offer. 2-3 assets for one is useally the way to go, gotta try to figure out whut they need.

Done all of them but it doesn't work. All my players are usually rated three stars and two of them isn't enough to get three stared players from other teams. Three or more never work as they just complain about imbalancing their roster.
Vey is a great example, he is rated three stars but got negative trade value to all teams at all times (yes I have tried them all multiple times, even for 7th round picks.).

visualdarkness:

Please, do not take it personaly, but your not so good results must come from your line or personal tactics. On the paper your roster looks not so bad. Goals against - 333 - that is way too much, you have also horrendous +/- stats.
What type of forecheck, puck pressure and mentality do you use mostly?
How about aggressiveness? You have 1181 PIM. If I were you, I would try to lower it.

Of course I know that but I tried literally every trick in my book. The PIMs racked up when I give up on the season and basically just simmed through as quick as possible, trying different standard tactics templates and asking the HC for the lines. I may have lost about 4-5 games extra doing this at most but it simply wasn't worth even trying anymore.

I blame at least 30 goals on Lehner sucking donkey balls.

I must do something vastly different from everyone else but the game give me absolutely no feedback of what that is. This is why I'm not having any fun, I see no difference at all no matter if I go all defense or all offense, personal tactics or not or any other perimeter. In EHM2007 I atleast saw difference in my teams play. I'm really starting to hate this game, which is a bummer as I've been waiting for a new version for almost 10 years.

[kennec]

Vey playd exellent for me. Always performing from hes RW and can sub as centers when needed.He mad 147 points in 220games for me.
OFC hes rated 3-4 stars for me.

[m0fownz0r]

I must do something vastly different from everyone else but the game give me absolutely no feedback of what that is. This is why I'm not having any fun, I see no difference at all no matter if I go all defense or all offense, personal tactics or not or any other perimeter. In EHM2007 I atleast saw difference in my teams play. I'm really starting to hate this game, which is a bummer as I've been waiting for a new version for almost 10 years.

That's really quite annoying. Not only it seems there is no difference in the match stats but sometimes its appears to be counter intuitive. I make a change, dominate the next game, allow 20+ shots less than the opposition only to lose the very next game 1:8, where most of team has 6-7s untill the 4-5th goal when the ratings drop for some of them. My goalie also appears to be doing a decent job, or atleast not letting in beach balls.

[sao.phim]

visualdarkness:

When I modify tactics, I feel the difference in most cases. True is, that sometimes I face stiff opposition and no matter what I tried, I lose. One of my first games in EA were seasons with Coyotes and darn, it sucked.
But after challenge with Flyers and couple of seasons with Leafs and Sabres, I start to spot differences in tactics settings.
What did not work for me definitely, was making too often tactical changes and massive moves on the roster and for every line. I guess it has to do something with "chemistry".

From my point of view it is better not to change half of the roster in short period of time, but better try to find specific role(s) for each player and try to find combos, which work well (from Flyers e.g. Voracek-Giroux, puck possession and power play monsters).

What is also important (but I practiced it in Flyers challenge only) - sometimes you have to adjust your tactics to your opponents. In Canucks challenge I have not done it yet. I focus on tuning my own squad first.

Just for the beginning - try to pair defencemen like one offensive / one hardworking or stay-at-home, dont let them carry the puck and dont let them play creative passing. Backcheck hard with at least one of them and one forward better too. For players, who are just getting tons of penalties, don't let them fight too often and go easy with them on Aggressiveness. Force your goalies to stay in the crease and don't play the puck. Set as your captain somebody with high Influence. Put on your Penalty Killing units only guys who are brave, have good stamina and positioning, work rate and team work might help too. And if you don't have great Penalty-Killers, try to avoid penalties as much as possible. Don't push hard for puck pressure, but rather try to build "wall" on your blue line. I personally try to use various defensive "systems" adjusted for each line.
If you are being out-shot, try to increase your Shooting frequency and simplify your game. On PP set guys with high Wristshot attribute to shoot selective/very selective. Use only creative guys as playmakers. Don't let carry the puck guys, who are weak with stickhandling and decking.
etc etc

Definitely it is much harder than in EHM2007 and I don't think there is some "guaranteed" tactics formula for winning with every team. Maybe just batdad figured it somehow ...

[sao.phim]

And also pay attention to fatigue or fitness of your players. If you have around 16 minutes in PK each game, your PK unit must be just devastated. Maybe change your practice schedule to 30-30-40 sometimes to get stronger on PK.

[sao.phim]

Maybe try to watch some games or key moments/highlights at least, for some time. It helped me in the Flyers challenge. Of course, there was that "turnover from the corner" bug, which was driving me crazy, but somehow time spent on that help me for tuning my squad.

[visualdarkness]

visualdarkness:

When I modify tactics, I feel the difference in most cases. True is, that sometimes I face stiff opposition and no matter what I tried, I lose. One of my first games in EA were seasons with Coyotes and darn, it sucked.
But after challenge with Flyers and couple of seasons with Leafs and Sabres, I start to spot differences in tactics settings.
What did not work for me definitely, was making too often tactical changes and massive moves on the roster and for every line. I guess it has to do something with "chemistry".

From my point of view it is better not to change half of the roster in short period of time, but better try to find specific role(s) for each player and try to find combos, which work well (from Flyers e.g. Voracek-Giroux, puck possession and power play monsters).

That was what I did to begin with, it didn't work at all.

What is also important (but I practiced it in Flyers challenge only) - sometimes you have to adjust your tactics to your opponents. In Canucks challenge I have not done it yet. I focus on tuning my own squad first.

I didn't do it due to me wanting the current tactics to gel first.

Just for the beginning - try to pair defencemen like one offensive / one hardworking or stay-at-home, dont let them carry the puck and dont let them play creative passing. Backcheck hard with at least one of them and one forward better too. For players, who are just getting tons of penalties, don't let them fight too often and go easy with them on Aggressiveness. Force your goalies to stay in the crease and don't play the puck. Set as your captain somebody with high Influence. Put on your Penalty Killing units only guys who are brave, have good stamina and positioning, work rate and team work might help too. And if you don't have great Penalty-Killers, try to avoid penalties as much as possible. Don't push hard for puck pressure, but rather try to build "wall" on your blue line. I personally try to use various defensive "systems" adjusted for each line.

Exactly how I did it. Not that my D-squad have been balanced in any way.

If you are being out-shot, try to increase your Shooting frequency and simplify your game. On PP set guys with high Wristshot attribute to shoot selective/very selective. Use only creative guys as playmakers. Don't let carry the puck guys, who are weak with stickhandling and decking.
etc etc

Tried it and had individual tactics set for shooting. Never ever had any success with playmakers in EHM2007 so I haven't payed attention to it.

Definitely it is much harder than in EHM2007 and I don't think there is some "guaranteed" tactics formula for winning with every team. Maybe just batdad figured it somehow ...

My team shouldn't be a 27 points one, I'm far from any optimum.

Maybe try to watch some games or key moments/highlights at least, for some time. It helped me in the Flyers challenge. Of course, there was that "turnover from the corner" bug, which was driving me crazy, but somehow time spent on that help me for tuning my squad.

That is how I usually watch games but this team just isn't fun to watch, only frustrating. People say you grow patient with age, I grow more and more impatient for every year gone and I simply don't seem to have it in me anymore to find out how to play EHM.

[sao.phim]

When I check the screenshots from your second season, honestly, I don't understand, how you could pile up so many penalties with every second player, if you did not let them fight and lowered their aggressiveness to "Easy"...

[Peter_Doherty]

I only made one move during the 2016-17 offseason. I traded Eddie Lack (he played terrible last season) for Valtteri Filppula and Jake Dotchin. Filppula can fill in a top 6 center role so I can develop Marner and Horvat.

Filppula is way too old, sorry bro.

How do I take control of the Utica farm team. I try to take control, but am only seeing the NHL in the "USA" categroy

You must set AHL to enhanced in your "Selected Leagues" settings.

How about Cole Cassels? Has he developed into solid 2nd/3rd liner for somebody?

Nope, but he might become my 4C + PK soon.

[sao.phim]

Visualdarkness:

Look, my first season was also disaster, dead-last in whole league. We lost many times by wide margin, four or five goal difference. But later on, despite losing streaks, we start to put "better" results, losing by one goal only etc. In my second season - I just finished Q2 - we are hovering around 6th-8th spot in the West, producing much more equal results and sometimes defeating even teams in upper echelons. Unfortunately, we lost plenty of games in overtime. But I see there significant difference and improvement despite the fact, that 90 % of my roster remain same as in the first season. Even my board is already pleased with performance and fans stopped raging and protesting.
I just had to give some effort and time into tinkering of my tactics and lines. If I would just "Give up" and simulate as fast as possible, I doubt something would improve. I never played for Canucks before, so my initial knowledge of the players was very limited. I expect some slump in this season again, I would be surprised to reach playoffs. Hope to finish second season tonight. But from the third season I want to attack playoffs for sure.

[m0fownz0r]

Yeah, maybe just scratch the unit tactics and go with team tactics.. tinkering with certain individual tacticcs?

[sao.phim]

I play with both - unit tactics and individual tactics also. I distinguish individual tactics between PP-PK-equal for each single individual.

[TheEpicOne258]

rubbish i forgot that incoming players have to be 24 and under. I have a save from a month earlier though so i can fix it easily

[watts555]

You must set AHL to enhanced in your "Selected Leagues" settings.

Omg, thank you so much man. You have truly been a savior to me this challenge

Also, I was thinking for the next challenge.. Something that might be interesting, is trying to build a team from out of the US and Canada. Meaning only able to get players from overseas and such. Would make for an interesting challenge in my opionon

[Peter_Doherty]

Hehe, no problems

[Asher413]

I personally have given up on this challenge for now, for very similar reasons to visualdarkness. I think looking back it's either my trade ability or the trade engine (once we suck, the guys can't be traded for a lot, so I can't improve, etc. etc.). Over the first 100 or so games in 10-15 game chunks I tried making tactics from scratch, I tried using all personal tactics, I tried using default tactics, and there really wasn't a large difference in results. I also virtually kept my lines the same all season since I didn't have any depth to assume changing them would work. Maybe its a lack of experience in 'coaching' (when I play personally I NEVER coach games, as I just haven't ever enjoyed the 2D match engine, I preferred CM/FM back in the text only days more.), but I am finding EA too hard to a nut to crack in that regard (keep in mind, I NEVER mastered 2007, and I think I've only won a couple of cups in 8 years.)

I do think he's hit on what I feel is the most frustrating, it's too far from obvious (to me at least) what is wrong with the tactic. Is your left defensman stupidly out of position due to his skill, morale, or what part of the tactic went wrong. I can't figure out why my team has completely stupid moments on the ice (oh look, a guy chased me behind the net, let's TURN INTO HIM, or we pulled the goalie on a PK with 1 minute left, let's CLEAR THE PUCK.). Why oh why does Tierney have the 4th or 5th best stats on my team but zero points in 15 games. Granted, this may be coming from a sour apples point of view, but the feedback is non-helpful or non-obvious as to what I'm doing so terribly wrong.

My personal plan- I'm playing with the challenge save I have under my rules (saved the old copy just in case I go back to it, but probably won't have time) and see if I can win PERIOD. Maybe I wasn't ready for challenges in EA... at least in 2007 I would be a playoff team in the challenges in a couple of years, but being on pace to be #1 overall pick two years in a row by a 10-15 point margin and not really understanding why isn't fun.

[bruins72]

I only made one move during the 2016-17 offseason. I traded Eddie Lack (he played terrible last season) for Valtteri Filppula and Jake Dotchin. Filppula can fill in a top 6 center role so I can develop Marner and Horvat.

Isn't Filppula way too old?

Yup! He's definitely too old.

[bruins72]

Hmm.. there seems to be a problem with my stats upload. I'm pretty confident I did already upload my stats for Q2,however it shows: Team Stats • Total as of 40 games.

I don't think there is a way to calculate Q2 and Q3 results now that I'm on game 62/3, is htere?

Try to calculate them by looking at the schedule. Try to at least get W-L-OTL and GF GA. You can kind of fudge the rest. Then put in the proper stats for Q3.

[kennec]

I personally have given up on this challenge for now, for very similar reasons to visualdarkness. I think looking back it's either my trade ability or the trade engine (once we suck, the guys can't be traded for a lot, so I can't improve, etc. etc.). Over the first 100 or so games in 10-15 game chunks I tried making tactics from scratch, I tried using all personal tactics, I tried using default tactics, and there really wasn't a large difference in results. I also virtually kept my lines the same all season since I didn't have any depth to assume changing them would work. Maybe its a lack of experience in 'coaching' (when I play personally I NEVER coach games, as I just haven't ever enjoyed the 2D match engine, I preferred CM/FM back in the text only days more.), but I am finding EA too hard to a nut to crack in that regard (keep in mind, I NEVER mastered 2007, and I think I've only won a couple of cups in 8 years.)

I do think he's hit on what I feel is the most frustrating, it's too far from obvious (to me at least) what is wrong with the tactic. Is your left defensman stupidly out of position due to his skill, morale, or what part of the tactic went wrong. I can't figure out why my team has completely stupid moments on the ice (oh look, a guy chased me behind the net, let's TURN INTO HIM, or we pulled the goalie on a PK with 1 minute left, let's CLEAR THE PUCK.). Why oh why does Tierney have the 4th or 5th best stats on my team but zero points in 15 games. Granted, this may be coming from a sour apples point of view, but the feedback is non-helpful or non-obvious as to what I'm doing so terribly wrong.

My personal plan- I'm playing with the challenge save I have under my rules (saved the old copy just in case I go back to it, but probably won't have time) and see if I can win PERIOD. Maybe I wasn't ready for challenges in EA... at least in 2007 I would be a playoff team in the challenges in a couple of years, but being on pace to be #1 overall pick two years in a row by a 10-15 point margin and not really understanding why isn't fun.

whuts your own rules? free trading and :
malkin-crosby-okposo and win cup?

[Peter_Doherty]

Just got around to start season 4, took me a few days to find the effort to set all the tactics (my luck with the game saving my personal tactics ran out) but now it's done. First game and Puljujärvi with 2+2

[batdad]

How do you know success in EHM:EA is only because of exploits when you've only played two careers and lost a lot in both?
Are you sure that everyone that has succeeded in EHM:EA only does so because of exploits?

Ofcourse there are exploits available, or nobody would be ably to get stats like this the first season with this team:
1 batdad (4) 1 82 54 19 9 117 0.713 225 146 9.67 87.72 851 $36.00m 16
2 kennec (4) 1 82 52 22 8 112 0.683 352 250 19.05 78.95 359 $39.00m 16
3 Unknown User (4) 1 82 53 26 3 109 0.665 297 212 17.45 79.58 628 $47.00m 16

Any tactics that pretty much guaranties winning with a team this sucky is an exploit and I would for sure use it if I knew about any I would use them. The game is based on algorithm and once you get them down you'll start winning no matter what. It was exactly the same way in EHM2007 and the FM-series when I played them.

Batdad knows how the game calculates for defense and mad cudos for him for finding it out, but it means that he will win no matter what. As I said, it's all about algorithms.

I don't have the time nor the energy to search for the exploits in the new engine so I will lose unless I'm a blind chicken finding a kernel of corn.

This really ticks me off Visual. I have been constantly winning at this game and EHM 2007, and I get accused of exploits? Give your head a shake. My roster sucked and my team sucked that first season. But tactically, I made it work. I went into a defensive shell...No d man at even strength had higher than safe passing set, no forward had higher than normal and the bottom 6 were less than that. I work with what I have...I match lines and I worked with the game the way it is.

It is sad that you think people had to exploit the game to win, and cannot give credit where credit is due. With the other game you were all high and mighty about stuff and how your team performed. Now you struggle a little and you blame the new game? And that people had success with it? Sorry pal....not the case....

I see you write as though even my figuring out defensive tactics is an exploit and that i win no matter what? YOu do realize that this is not the case. I win when I coach. Why? Because I play with individual tactics until I have that player doing well. Once I cannot figure them out...and they do not play well...they come out of the lineup..and then get moved.

You write about how you have to rely on DIllon for defensive purposes. I have Dillon and I cannot figure him out either. 2 seasons plus 20 games in. Guess what? He does not play for me anymore unless I MUST use him. I rely on noone for anything. THey play well...they play...they do not I tweak personal tactics until they do play well. If they do not play well...they get out for good.

Your first line should be lighting it up for you. CLearly you are doing something wrong with it.
Your second line -- no offense--SUCKS. Those Russians are at best third line guys in this game.
You rely on Dillon--he sucks

it is clear to me you have not figured this team out and are whining about others who have. THat is sad. It is not us, we figured some things out and have had varied degrees of success with it. And you say we MUST exploit the game.

As I have said many a time. I start with a basic team tactic. I tweak it until it works, and I change it up here and there through a season. I play with individual tactics all the time. As soon as guys have success I stop tweaking them. Every game is different. Every game I have different times.

I think if I understood everything About this game and was able to exploit it....I would have a ridiculous PP as well. I do not.

You have to go back to the drawing board and figure some things out about your team. I see some names posted and have not looked at your screen shots to any great extent. But if you are relying on Grigorenko and Girgensons to get the job done for you it explains alot.


Your defense. Your top peforming dmen are Weber and a what 20 year old Lindgren?

That tells me a ton. Dillon sucks and would not have him in there.\

I have Trouba. ANd I bet others dollars to donuts they have someone who is a 1-2 dman and probably a couple of good performing 3-4. You do not.

That there alone screws up your team.

Now I have said enough on this, and you telling me I exploit the game and have an alogrithm to win in this game really ticks me off. So go please hide somewhere else and cry. It is a game. You do not do well this time. Life goes on.

We who have success do not exploit the game, we who have success learn from our mistakes and change things up. Go back and look at my first couple of challenge stats. I Was not very good. Because I Stuck with what I believed WOULD work, instead of figuring out what DID work. That is your problem right now, and nowhere is more obvious than saying that you have to rely on DIllon. You do not. You choose to rely on Dillon and that is not smart and is probably causing you to lose a game here and there all on its own.