1974/75: Nino's Rosters - Mario Lemieux as an 8 year old

[Manimal]

If the Reputation is set low enough (80 and under IIRC) the player will not get an NHL Release Clause added to their contract at start up - BUT the NHL teams still sign them away! European/Russian contracts have been shown to be meaningless to the NHL teams for some reason...

It is the same IRL. The NHL can sign European(other than from Russia/KHL) players even if they have contract without clause

[nino33]

I'm now running the same test with an actual 1974 start date (it was pretty exciting to see 1974 on the screen for the first time!)

Started the test last night (first time ever using the CSD), saved and went to bed and started it up again this AM and before long "crash" - turns out I'd forgotten to use the CSD Patch when reloading the game!


Currently I'm adding League Records (NHL/Major Junior) and Team Records (Major Junior), and I'm reviewing the team data a bit (Clubs tab in Pregame Editor)

[Primis]

I set the NHL to an age cap of like 12 years old

I can't do that...I was looking to keep Europeans/Russians in Europe/Russia, I wasn't looking to eliminate the NHL

I know. I'm saying that even *with* doing that, they still won't sign in Europe. That was my whole point. I don't see any possible way to have the NHL still going even and have them sign away from it.

I spent like 3 days working on this problem months ago trying to get a DB where the RSL was the premier league (was trying to make a league with like 3 or 4 Canadian teams, 3 or American, 4 Russian, 2 or 3 Swedish, etc... and those teams would be required to ice mostly their own nationality of players), and I really couldn't make it happen to include the top level NHL players. Even setting NHL to a 12 years old cap, releasing all NHLers as free agents, bumping RSL rep to 20... they still wouldn't sign.

After I whacked everyone in the DB's reps down by like 30% I'm pretty sure that was enough they all were willing to sign then. However the mass editor I used to do it flaked out and messed-up some other attributes it wasn't supposed to, so I finally just gave up.

One possible solution would be to figure out a way to SAFELY mass-edit everyone player reps down in the DB, by maybe 15% or 20% or something. That would take care of the problem in near future. However it would not prevent player reps from rising again through natural growth and ending up n the same position a few years later.

[archibalduk]

One possible solution would be to figure out a way to SAFELY mass-edit everyone player reps down in the DB, by maybe 15% or 20% or something. That would take care of the problem in near future. However it would not prevent player reps from rising again through natural growth and ending up n the same position a few years later.

That's pretty easy to do. I want to add some form of mass editing to the Updater and will stick rep editing on my to do list.

[nino33]

When players like Tretiak started with a single digit Reputation they were still signed immediately by the NHL from the Russian League...so I'm really not sure how the reputation reduction would help

I spent weeks on this, multiple times over the last few years, testing many different options, and my conclusion has been to essentially stop trying to HaHa (I have more than enough to do!)...perhaps things are handled by the game differently when a player has a high CA (170-200) - it'll be interesting to see how the new TBL rosters work with Kovalchuck in Russia

I don't think modern databases have had 170-200 CA player start outside of the NHL, and using such databases in tests may produce different results than the 1974 database.

In the most recent TBL Rosters (5.3d) there are no players that start in Russia with a CA above 160 (the "Good" threshold in the NHL); the top CA players in Russia are Zinovyev (154 CA) and Radulov (152 CA)...in the 1974 database the top players in Russia are Tretiak/Yakushev (175 CA) and Kharlamov (170 CA)

One possible solution would be to figure out a way to SAFELY mass-edit everyone

Since the Updater came out last year it's been easy to do this in mass for pretty much any Attribute...and now it's even easier/better with Updater 2.0 (and we can now edit Staff Attributes too)

[nino33]

One possible solution would be to figure out a way to SAFELY mass-edit everyone player reps down in the DB, by maybe 15% or 20% or something. That would take care of the problem in near future. However it would not prevent player reps from rising again through natural growth and ending up n the same position a few years later.

That's pretty easy to do. I want to add some form of mass editing to the Updater and will stick rep editing on my to do list.

For me the "excel functionality" of the Updater spreadsheets allows this to be easily done right now...it takes a couple/few minutes, but it's not hard (and given the sorting options available it's a preferred method to me) - I have frequently done this already...add a new calculation column, put a formula in to reduce/increase the Attribute by a percentage, then paste the results/values in the appropriate Attribute column and delete the calculation column and done!

[CJ]

I have made ~70 3d logos for this pack so far. "Huge" sized logos. After this I'll do all the other sizes and I'm done. Only three teams (Bulls, Canadiens & Totems) with one single logo, all the others have a few options for the player to choose from. A few of them has newer logos aswell if the player wants to use it... (And why not if you've played 20 seasons )

PS: Way off topic, but Nino, I see you're from Edmonton, are you Oilers fan?

[nino33]

I have made ~70 3d logos for this pack so far. "Huge" sized logos. After this I'll do all the other sizes and I'm done. Only three teams (Bulls, Canadiens & Totems) with one single logo, all the others have a few options for the player to choose from. A few of them has newer logos aswell if the player wants to use it... (And why not if you've played 20 seasons

Awesome!

Nino, I see you're from Edmonton, are you Oilers fan?

I'm 46, my hockey favourites have changed over time (and while I've lived in Edmonton for over 20 years [and live blocks from Rexall Place] I grew up in B.C.)

1976 Habs
1976-1990s Canucks fan, die hard Flyers fan, hated the Oilers
1990s-2000s lost a lot of interest...my kids were young, and with Flyer management actions , labour disputes/etc I increasingly lost interest in NHL
early 2000s no longer hated the Oilers! They were so bad pity seemed more appropriate HaHa...still not following hockey like I used to
2006-2009 no longer a Canucks/Flyers fan, enjoyed being in Edmonton during the Oilers Cup Final run, cheering for but not really an Oilers fan
2009-present discovered EHM/TBL...ever increasing interest in hockey/NHL again! , but still struggling HaHa http://www.ehmtheblueline.com/forums/vi ... 76#p157776

You an Oilers fan?
Favourite team in Finland?

[archibalduk]

After this I'll do all the other sizes and I'm done.

I can't remember if it was you or somebody else I mentioned this to, but are you using FastStone Photo Resizer? This is really useful because once you have created the huge logos, the resizer can create copies for each of the large/medium/small sizes.

[CJ]

You an Oilers fan?
Favourite team in Finland?

No I'm no Oilers fan, I'm a Ducks fan (my avatar should tell you that)!? I've been losing some interest in them though in resent years, and I don't have any other team in mind either.
In SM-Liiga when I was young I liked TPS. Late 90's I changed to HPK cause nobody was a fan of them, and I'm still.

The funny thing is that before Jukka Jalonen was their (HPK) coach they were 11:th that year (out of 14 teams), after him they finished 12th in the league. When he was coaching them they won 1 gold (only gold so far), 4 bronze medals, and one 4th position in 6 years he was coaching them. After that he was the coach of Finland's national team a few years (he quit this year). And managed to win our second gold medal in history. I'd say a pretty hardcore coach if you ask me... Now he's in SKA (KHL)

I can't remember if it was you or somebody else I mentioned this to, but are you using FastStone Photo Resizer? This is really useful because once you have created the huge logos, the resizer can create copies for each of the large/medium/small sizes.

No you haven't mentioned it to me. Thanks I'm gonna check it out.
EDIT: Works great and went fast. Though some logos are really long/wide which I manually have to change.

[nino33]

An update…

Since the release of 2.0
- Additional player stats/history added
- added many (not all) historical US College players in “shell form” (first stage of editing)
- extensive editing of historical European/Russian players (second stage of editing)
- improvement/correction of European/Russian team names

Recent progress
- Historical League Records for Major Junior/Minor Pro added
- all “post 1974 retired numbers” removed (many were already removed)
- started the process to add average/appropriate “fake” Staff to NA Minor Pro/Major Junior Leagues
- I’ve used the new Updater to calculate the Strength Attribute as well as "Optimizing the Database"
- currently reviewing/editing NHL player attributes!

RE adding fake Staff - this is a “for now” solution…I intend on inputting all available historical staff when I have the time
As well there’s a number of other smaller issues that have been addressed, and others that have been at least worked on if not addressed (everything in stages!)



Currently I’m looking at a number of Attributes using the Updater's exported_attributes file (FYI - many columns are “hidden” in the screenshot below)…right now I’m primarily looking at Aggression, but also Bravery/Dirtiness/Fighting/Agitation.

In the screen shot I’ve had not yet begun to actually make edits (when I do I always highlight them yellow…when I’m done I know all/only the yellow are the edits), but I have added some actual historical data (the grey columns) to help me as I make editing decisions

FYI - Columns X and Z are Defensive/Offensive Role. Next to them is the average rating of the “applicable” Defensive/Offensive Attributes (according to the Attribute Guide)…this too I do to help me in deciding where and what edits to make.

Column C = average goals scored per NHL game
Column D = average points scored per NHL game
Column E = player age
Column AL = average penalty minutes per NHL game
I find such "general information" helps me when making decisions about Attributes
Also helpful I find is the use of excel functionality to sort the different columns and then compare/look for anomalies



P.S. I didn't realize Bob Nystrom (line 22) was so overrated! A good player, a tough player, a clutch scorer...but not a 160 CA in 1974!

[CJ]

Nice work!

I can do the SM-Liiga team colour for you when I've finished the logos. I'll look them up and send you the name of the colours of each team.

EDIT: Here are the logos for NHL & SM-Liiga in "3D"
Dunno what you're gonna name the SM-Liiga teams so they might have to be updated after that. And someone might wanna add a "READ ME" with the file if needed...

Download link: http://www18.zippyshare.com/v/22603040/file.html

[nino33]

Here are the logos for NHL & SM-Liiga in "3D"

Awesome!

Dunno what you're gonna name the SM-Liiga teams

I'm planning on releasing the database in about 7-10 days; I'm not intending on doing any additional work on team names before release (so for now they'll stay the same as indicated on July 7th in this thread)

[Sonic Youth]

Just hoping in the topic to say: THANK YOU!
Wow, what an awesome job done with that roster, I'm really enjoying it.

Of course I could not resist to take control of my Montreal Canadiens, which made the game a bit non-challenging, but still I'm enjoying watching the records race between my players. I had a duo of Lafleur-Dionne for almost their whole career, they finished with 2600+ pts each, a tiny 30pts advance for Lafleur for the best scorer of all time title Lindros just got drafted, at 7 foot 3 and 280lbs I guess he got some offers also from the Chicago Bulls

Anyway, looking forward to the update!

[nino33]

THANK YOU!Wow, what an awesome job done with that roster, I'm really enjoying it.

Thanks for the kind words; glad to hear you're enjoying it!

Lindros just got drafted, at 7 foot 3 and 280lbs I guess he got some offers also from the Chicago Bulls

There's some problems with really young players (players under age 13)...not only does their height/weight overdevelop, but their birthdate is randomized (while keeping the same year) at start-up.....Archi's working on a "SavedGame Updater" - once completed/released, this should allow for these issues to be "fixed" relatively easily!

[massimou]

Sorry if this has been answered earlier, I couldn't find an answer. In this database, are "modern" players created as the game goes on? Ex. is Sidney Crosby created when the game reaches a certain year?

[nino33]

Sorry if this has been answered earlier, I couldn't find an answer. In this database, are "modern" players created as the game goes on? Ex. is Sidney Crosby created when the game reaches a certain year?

Currently the youngest historical players are age 1 at start-up (born in 1973 IRL), so no Sidney Crosby

[Animal31]

Do you know if you could find a way for regens to be regened on your tyke teams, at appropriate ages?

[nino33]

Do you know if you could find a way for regens to be regened on your tyke teams, at appropriate ages?

Not possible; in EHM players regen at age 14-16...the "Upper Age" limit for the Tyke League is age 6

Actually I'd prefer if my historical players showed up in-game at age 14-16 too, and if a SavedGame Updater ever allows for new players to be created/added to a game already in-progress I'd look to stop having such young players (plus it would allow new/historical players to be added right up to the present time!)

[nino33]

An update…
Since the release of 2.0
- Additional player stats/history added
- added many (not all) historical US College players in “shell form” (first stage of editing)
- extensive editing of historical European/Russian players (second stage of editing)
- improvement/correction of European/Russian team names
Recent progress
- Historical League Records for Major Junior/Minor Pro added
- all “post 1974 retired numbers” removed (many were already removed)
- started the process to add average/appropriate “fake” Staff to NA Minor Pro/Major Junior Leagues
- I’ve used the new Updater to calculate the Strength Attribute as well as "Optimizing the Database"
- currently reviewing/editing NHL player attributes!

NHL Player Attributes (including Aggression) are currently being reviewed/improved!

As well AHL/CHL Staff are being added right now!
I'm adding historical Staff whenever possible, and using "fake Staff" where needed

Ideally I'd like to do Major Junior Staff too, plus review the Attributes of historical Major Junior players, add fake Major Junior players where needed, review the Attributes of historical Minor Pro players, add extra young historical European/Russian players...there's just so much more I'd like to do!
But NHL Player Attributes + AHL/CHL Staff are my current focus...I can't see getting any more done before the release of version 3 (before month's end!)....for me it's kinda nice for me to have a "deadline" of sorts, just to feel "done" for a moment will be great!

FYI - Columns X and Z are Defensive/Offensive Role. Next to them is the average rating of the “applicable” Defensive/Offensive Attributes (according to the Attribute Guide)…this too I do to help me in deciding where and what edits to make.

Column C = average goals scored per NHL game
Column D = average points scored per NHL game
Column E = player age
Column AL = average penalty minutes per NHL game
I find such "general information" helps me when making decisions about Attributes

FYI - I ended up adding NHL/WHA GP too

[CJ]

I'm now gonna check out the team colours of the Finnish SM-Liiga. I'll post the list here when it's done.

[nino33]

I'm now gonna check out the team colours of the Finnish SM-Liiga. I'll post the list here when it's done.

Great!


FYI - As mentioned above, I'm looking forward to being "done" with the 1974 database for a bit, and doing something different for awhile! As I just posted on the OOTP/FHM site - I am pleased to be taking over as FHM researcher for the Western Hockey League. This will be my editing focus for the remainder of the summer once the 1974 database is released next weekend

[archibalduk]

I'll get the next CSD Patch and Retro Launcher properly tested this week so that it is released in time for the next version of your DB. Pending any unexpected bugs of course!...

[CJ]

Okay, I understand! Here's the list as a "notepad" for you: http://www28.zippyshare.com/v/27617999/file.html

[nino33]

I'll get the next CSD Patch and Retro Launcher properly tested this week so that it is released in time for the next version of your DB. Pending any unexpected bugs of course!...

Awesome!

Okay, I understand! Here's the list as a "notepad" for you: http://www28.zippyshare.com/v/27617999/file.html

Thanks!