losing prospects' rights despite signing them?

JimH · Post by **JimH** » Sat Dec 12, 2009 3:50 am

I did a forum search and didn't find anything relating to this.

Using the most recent Lidas database, I keep losing prospect rights on July 1st. I know that if a draft pick goes four years without a contract he becomes a free agent, but the guys I've lost are guys who I have not only previously signed, but who have played two or three years on my farm team They're classified as Group II free agents (I had previously qualified them) until July 1st then they're gone. Any else having this happen?

jbsnadb · Post by **jbsnadb** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:18 am

Are you certain that you are qualifying them? Sometimes salary + bonus is more than the necessary amount to qualify, but in reality, the bonus does not count.

stone169 · Post by **stone169** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 3:37 am

I've noticed something similar to this with older prospects in Lidas 2.1 roster. I've qualified the RFAs and if I don't sign them within the first week of free agency, I then lose their rights. I just figured it's an unavoidable glitch with the rosters because Lidas had to change the age of all the players.

clarke19 · Post by **clarke19** » Sun Dec 13, 2009 7:58 pm

stone169 wrote:I've noticed something similar to this with older prospects in Lidas 2.1 roster. I've qualified the RFAs and if I don't sign them within the first week of free agency, I then lose their rights. I just figured it's an unavoidable glitch with the rosters because Lidas had to change the age of all the players.

I'm my game I had Jakub Voracek get picked up by another team because of this. Also guys like Max Pacioretty and Kyle Okposo found their way into UFA.

stone169 · Post by **stone169** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:30 am

clarke19 wrote:
stone169 wrote:I've noticed something similar to this with older prospects in Lidas 2.1 roster. I've qualified the RFAs and if I don't sign them within the first week of free agency, I then lose their rights. I just figured it's an unavoidable glitch with the rosters because Lidas had to change the age of all the players.
I'm my game I had Jakub Voracek get picked up by another team because of this. Also guys like Max Pacioretty and Kyle Okposo found their way into UFA.

It happened to me with Jonas Hillier in Anaheim. I qualified him and I had big plans for him as Giguere's future with the Ducks was looking kind of short. He started off as an RFA and then midway through July he became a UFA. Now I have to develop another goalie to take over from Giguere. piddle me off.

clarke19 · Post by **clarke19** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 1:46 am

stone169 wrote:
clarke19 wrote:
stone169 wrote:I've noticed something similar to this with older prospects in Lidas 2.1 roster. I've qualified the RFAs and if I don't sign them within the first week of free agency, I then lose their rights. I just figured it's an unavoidable glitch with the rosters because Lidas had to change the age of all the players.
I'm my game I had Jakub Voracek get picked up by another team because of this. Also guys like Max Pacioretty and Kyle Okposo found their way into UFA.
It happened to me with Jonas Hillier in Anaheim. I qualified him and I had big plans for him as Giguere's future with the Ducks was looking kind of short. He started off as an RFA and then midway through July he became a UFA. Now I have to develop another goalie to take over from Giguere. p*** me off.

I had to rush Taylor Hall into a top 6 spot because Voracek signed with San Jose after.

He hasn't done bad but I'd rather have Voracek.

JimH · Post by **JimH** » Mon Dec 14, 2009 3:23 am

With me it was Andrew Cogliano and Jordan Eberle. I managed to re-sign Eberle as a free agent (to a ridiculous contract) but lost Cogliano to Atlanta who for some reason gave him almost $3MM/yr. Both guys had been qualified long before July 1st.

Richie Daggers Crime · Mon Dec 14, 2009 8:24 am

This is happening to me as well. Despite qualifying Freddy Meyer and Josh Bailey, they became UFAs in July. This is happening to other teams, as Turris, Bodker, Hamill, and Cowen all went from being pending RFAs to UFAs as though they weren't qualified.

I'm certain they were qualified, since their info page no longer had (Needs a qualifying offer) and my final June "expiring contracts" status email showed that the players had indeed been qualified.

Post by **visualdarkness** » Sat Dec 19, 2009 3:01 am

stone169 wrote:
clarke19 wrote:
stone169 wrote:I've noticed something similar to this with older prospects in Lidas 2.1 roster. I've qualified the RFAs and if I don't sign them within the first week of free agency, I then lose their rights. I just figured it's an unavoidable glitch with the rosters because Lidas had to change the age of all the players.
I'm my game I had Jakub Voracek get picked up by another team because of this. Also guys like Max Pacioretty and Kyle Okposo found their way into UFA.
It happened to me with Jonas Hillier in Anaheim. I qualified him and I had big plans for him as Giguere's future with the Ducks was looking kind of short. He started off as an RFA and then midway through July he became a UFA. Now I have to develop another goalie to take over from Giguere. p*** me off.

I traded away three good to great prospects to make a balanced trade with the Ducks, only to lose him this way a couple of month later...

Kbs · Post by **Kbs** » Sun Dec 20, 2009 4:43 am

This has happened to me too with Nazem Kadri. I was completely sure I made a qualifying offer and then on July 1st he was a UFA.

Post by **visualdarkness** » Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:15 am

My only comfort is that he is BRUTAL in Detroit at the moment while Biron plays good despite my super-offensive tactics.

toddpaul · Post by **toddpaul** » Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:10 am

This has happened to me numerous times with several different prospects, but I would always just then sign a min. wage player and add GM and trade for the lost player. (I just feel I shouldn't be penalized for something that's wrong with the game.) I've had this happen to me with half a dozen players once in one off-season.

coasterholic14 · Post by **coasterholic14** » Sun Dec 20, 2009 3:55 pm

I also had this happen to me in Lidas 2.1 after my first year with the Rangers, I failed to resign Wiikman in time (the only player I had as an RFA) and a couple days later my "rights" to him expired...thankfully I was able to resign him afterwards anyway (then I was hoping this would happen to Milan Lucic so I could sign him lol).

Footnote75 · Post by **Footnote75** » Thu Dec 31, 2009 12:13 pm

Yup, I lost Dadonov this way and it was horrifying. He was just starting to get REALLY good in this save!

canucksfan94 · Post by **canucksfan94** » Sat Jan 02, 2010 7:15 am

I have a similar problem so I guess I'll just post it here..

I keep losing the rights to my prospects on June 3rd when it says I'm supposed to have their rights for another "x" amount of years. Any idea why?

rfroese · Post by **rfroese** » Mon Jan 18, 2010 6:47 pm

This is happening becuase they are signed to contracts but the game doesn't recognize them as being signed draft picks. So when the time for them to be signed as a draft pick comes up they become UFAs. Only idea I've had is to have them start as RFA's and then sign them so the game understands that they are signed draft picks instead of Unqualified draft picks.

deathknot · Post by **deathknot** » Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:10 pm

it;s a little hard to rebiuld when your team disappears on you.

i've had 13+ players leave me without notice. Fowler,MPS,Eller and countless others

rfroese · Post by **rfroese** » Wed Jan 20, 2010 10:14 pm

Not sure yet, but it might work to sign them to one year extensions for whatever they want and then qualify the prospects for the following year and have them not walk...

Malone_is_AmericanFinesse · Tue May 11, 2010 7:00 pm

Yeah, this happens to me too. With a lot of the same players that you guys mention. Interestingly, it doesn't seem to happen later on in the game with regen prospects. I don't really know a ton about database entering, but this could have something to do with the history of the player. Let me try to maybe make a suggestion:

In the NHL, you lose a North American player two years after being drafted if he's unsigned (this includes a player like Voracek as he was drafted out of Halifax of the QMJHL). If he's on your farm club for a couple seasons, he's registering little or no NHL time and is lost as an unsigned prospect - not an unrestricted group III free agent (like an UNqualified group II restricted free agent). Leaving as an unsigned prospect in this game does not require the player to re-enter the draft.

My suggestion would be to give these players a proper history or proper experience or something to trick the game into thinking he's played a couple seasons in the NHL.

Or, and additionally, these players would be much easier to re-sign in the first place if they weren't given their whole bonus structure (I've seen some of these bonuses in these contracts, they are nearly impossible to hit, those level 'A' bonuses). There's no reason for Andrew Cogliano to be making $2.25 million or whatever he makes.

Let's come up with a system for future edits:
Tier I prospects get their salary + half of their performance bonus value (Doughty, Bogosian, Stamkos, Voracek etc.)
Tier II prospects get their salary + one-quarter of their performance bonus value (Mikael Backlund, James Neal, Oscar Moller, Max Pacioretty)
Tier III prospects get their salary only (ya know, the rest of them...Evgeni Dadonov, Andrew Cogliano I guess, etc.)

bruins72 · Post by **bruins72** » Tue May 11, 2010 7:10 pm

Interesting idea. You should mention it over in the Lidas Rosters suggestion thread.

zeppelin89 · Post by **zeppelin89** » Thu May 13, 2010 6:09 pm

I have noticed the exact same thing, and in fact I have also been able to take advantage of this (I think).

Does anyone else notice extremely good young players appearing in FA because the other teams didn't sign them?

I've seen

Kyle Turris
Cody Hodgson
Jonathan Blum

e.t.c

Post by **visualdarkness** » Thu May 13, 2010 6:12 pm

Oh yeah, I've seen (and earlier signed) loads of them.

I've seen at least:
Gagner
Plante
Cogliano (Oilers let almost all their prespects go one season)
Turris
Hogson
Lucic
etc

zeppelin89 · Post by **zeppelin89** » Thu May 13, 2010 6:13 pm

It makes the game extremely easy eh

Post by **visualdarkness** » Thu May 13, 2010 6:18 pm

zeppelin89 wrote:It makes the game extremely easy eh

That's an understatement, now I play by the challange rules or somewhat like them. I don't care who the AI signes as long as I get fun game to play in the long run.

maxrsp · Post by **maxrsp** » Fri Jul 30, 2010 4:44 pm

This happens to me regularly in the first couple years of a new game, but if you are paying attention you should never actually lose these players...

First of all, you get a message for every player that leaves you as an unsigned prospect. Once you see this just go ahead and re-sign them for whatever they are asking plus $25k/yr. I've yet to lose a player to another team as a result of this issue.

Good luck keeping all those hot prospects!