Trading

[B. Stinson]

In regards to trade negotiations, would it be difficult to make this more real-time? Kind of like if you were talking over the phone? Because nowadays, I would think it's pretty rare that GM's submit an offer to another GM, and then wait in the dark for a response like EHM does it. I'd be willing to bet most negotiating is done "live" on the phone.

I think the days of waiting for responses died when the telegraph was invented way back in the 1800's.

Oh and what is constant on at least Lidas' databases, when team let's say Flyers place Blair Betts on waivers and I as Canucks want to claim him, but already there is 4 claims placed so there is no possibilities for me to claim Betts. This could be worked out anyhow?

Actually, this is just a natural function of the NHL. I believe the waiver priority favors the lower placed teams in the standings.

[dabo]

In regards to trade negotiations, would it be difficult to make this more real-time? Kind of like if you were talking over the phone? Because nowadays, I would think it's pretty rare that GM's submit an offer to another GM, and then wait in the dark for a response like EHM does it. I'd be willing to bet most negotiating is done "live" on the phone.

I think I showed on a screenshot that I have a ribbon button called Phone, that's where this feature comes in. Then you can call the gm of your choice and receive calls as well. It will be a lot more work than the "normal" way but definitely doable. If implemented well, I think this could be a very nice feature.

I figured it would work something like this:

Code: Select all

Calling Brian Burke...

Brian Burke
- Brian Burke here...

You
- Hello Brian, how are you doing?

Brian Burke
- I am fine thank you, what's on your mind?

You
- I've heard Tomas Kaberle is on the trading block, what are you looking for in return?

Brian Burke
- I want a top 6 forward, preferably a power forward, or a 1st round draft pick +.

You
- How about this? <Initial offer submitted>

Brian Burke
- I am sorry that won't work, how about you adding <Player> to that offer?

You
- If I am to include him, I need something more from you.

Brian Burke
- Hmm, I suppose I could include a late draft pick. Would this work for you? <offer updated>

You
- bla bla...

Something like that, let's pretend that is how they negotiate. I guess then you can ask to call back in a day or two if you need time to consider an offer or just call him a fool and hang up.

I guess it would work something like the press conferences in FM 2010. This is my goal at least but hopefully it will become reality some day. If I am really ambitious trade negotiations could influence your future relationship with another gm.

[philou21]

Wow this would be awesome!

[Ogilthorpe]

I really like the idea of more depth to trade talks in the game.
I can't say I'm familiar with the press conferences in FM 2010 as I boycott everything by SI since they dropped NHL EHM...lol

[Alessandro]

I agree with Empach. The phone is a very nice idea, but I think it's maybe something for the second release? How should it work in Europe btw? And I love the space bar as hotkey.
Did you think about the leagues included?

[dabo]

The phone is a very nice idea, but I think it's maybe something for the second release?

Yeah at the earliest, in the beginning I will keep everything as simple as possible.

How should it work in Europe btw?

Leagues that allow trading will work the same. But in all leagues you can sign UFAs, so something similar should be available when talking to a player/agent.

Did you think about the leagues included?

From the database's pow there should be no limits (partly true), but since we have to take performance etc into consideration I guess I will have to do something like NHL:EHM does, let the user choose playable leagues. But what leagues are in the game, playable or not, are determined by the selected database.

[axwel3221]

That phone thing could be a star object!

you could call a secretary or something for a list of free agents phones and stuff and not just get a message of he is unwilling to move north america, but negotiate and talk about the reasons and stuff!

And hell no anyone calling Brian Burke?

Absolutely stunning work dabo!

[bruins72]

I always wanted something where I could set a desired return for a player. Like how the Thrashers wanted a top 4 d-men, top 6 forward, top prospect and a 1st round pick for Kovalchuk. If there was some kind of system where I could set the desired return that would be really nice.

I like this. Maybe have it tied to when you put a player up on the trading block as available.

[alexob18]

If it hasn't been mentioned before, have a GM to GM relation meter.

Say:

Burke - Lowe. Hate each other - will never trade.

If anyone's played NFL Head Coach you'll know what I'm talking about.

[philou21]

Wow good idea! I think it could be really cool, will be harder to negociate with some GMs.

[watts555]

Also, when a players contract expires, and before they are technically released to free agency.. can you make it possible to trade that players rights?

[dabo]

Since that is something that happens more and more I guess I should. It is in the long term plans.

[empach]

Ne careful with that. It does happen but not too often, and usually only with top players that the other team is going to sign before free agency.

[alexob18]

It's becoming more frequent though. Hamhuis this year, JBo last year.

[philou21]

I don't think in a video game we should add that. ( trade rights ) To me, it's just a way to screw the game. If you can't sign a player and you're not able to do it, or trade him at the dead line, sorry but you just lose him, point. Like EHM right now. I think it would be too easy to just wait at the end of the season and trade him for something if you see you can't sign him.

[empach]

I don't think in a video game we should add that. ( trade rights ) To me, it's just a way to screw the game. If you can't sign a player and you're not able to do it, or trade him at the dead line, sorry but you just lose him, point. Like EHM right now. I think it would be too easy to just wait at the end of the season and trade him for something if you see you can't sign him.

What if it could only be triggered by the other team? So say I'm playing as Nashville, and the AI controlled Flyers could inquire about Hamhuis rights. But I wouldn't be able to shop his rights around the league. It's not realistic but it would avoid users abusing it.

The real key would be setting up the AI so that it remains rare. Something that only happens once or twice a season, and only with top young players that the acquiring team has the cap space for and the intention of signing. And the return would have to be set appropriately as well.

[gibson41]

I don't think in a video game we should add that. ( trade rights ) To me, it's just a way to screw the game. If you can't sign a player and you're not able to do it, or trade him at the dead line, sorry but you just lose him, point. Like EHM right now. I think it would be too easy to just wait at the end of the season and trade him for something if you see you can't sign him.

Good point.

[laskey 16]

If it hasn't been mentioned before, have a GM to GM relation meter.

Say:

Burke - Lowe. Hate each other - will never trade.

If anyone's played NFL Head Coach you'll know what I'm talking about.

I like this idea, but of course in real life Dave Nonis would negotiate with Kevin Lowe, or whoever, on behalf of Burke. Would be cool if that could be implemented - ability to ask your assistant to make the phone call on your behalf or something. Real time trades would be ideal though, good idea.

It'd be cool if teams could say "we would expect overpayment to trade such a big player on our team to a division/conference rival", and if rival teams (say NYI and NYR) rarely traded with each other.

I also agree that it should be harder to trade the rights of expiring contracts, but possible... maybe if someone inquires specifically though. It should also be more difficult to sign free agents... would be cool if you're an Eastern Conference team and someone who has always played out West says he wouldn't like to relocate so far, or something. And also players should reject you if you have lots of good players in their position and they want ice time.

[bruins72]

If you're going to allow live trades that are responded to right away, there should be some sort of "mood" bar implemented. If you keep throwing stupid trades at another GM, he's will become frustrated and hang up on you. If you're close, the mood bar shouldn't move that much unless you get further away from that GM's expectations. If a GM hangs up on you, you should have to wait a week before he'll take your call again. Also, some GMs who might not like each other, or teams that are rivals, the mood bar should start off further along. You don't have as much leeway with this team so you risk getting hung up on more easily.

[dabo]

Yeah I guess we need something like that to make it harder to abuse the system.

[philou21]

for the "normal" trades it could be really usefull. But I still think trading rights shouldn't be add to the game.

[laskey 16]

for the "normal" trades it could be really usefull. But I still think trading rights shouldn't be add to the game.

For prospects, it's necessary. Expiring contracts, that's debatable. It does happen in real life every now and then, but of course could be exploited. If it can't be implemented in a way that prevents this maybe it shouldn't go in.

[philou21]

Yes I understand but I don't talk about prospect at all, this can't be remove. It's making trade like the one with Hamhuis last week and Bouwmeester last year, I'm still septic about that.

[philou21]

I just thought of something when I was in the shower. I was thinking about trading the rights of futur UFA. In real life you can't put right on the block, it make things more easy then I thought at the start.

If you are not able to sign the player or you just don't want to resign him, when 1st July is getting closer, some teams will maybe be really interest in that player and approach you for having the exclusivity to negociate with him.

The point his, just the other teams can approach you to trade for the rights, you can't. If you want to have the exclusivity for a player, you can approach the other GM but for avoiding exploitation we can make a % of chance the GM want to negociate with you.

With the "phone system" Dabo show us, it would be pretty cool I think. When you approach for the rights of the players we just have to make the AI more tougher. Like a 30% of success and 70% of failure. ( or 40-60 or 50-50 )

Since trading rights doesn't happen quite often, do you think Dabo you can put a "restriction" on that in the game? Like an 8 months injury don't happen too often, could be the same for that and by making negociation more harder than a normal trade, I think we can avoid people to exploit the game.

I don't know if you'll understand clearly. If you can't....well sorry.

[empach]

The point his, just the other teams can approach you to trade for the rights, you can't. If you want to have the exclusivity for a player, you can approach the other GM but for avoiding exploitation we can make a % of chance the GM want to negociate with you.

Yeah I suggested the same kind of thing above.
I think another key part of trading UFA rights is making the return conditional on the team signing the player they trade for. Usually that's how these things are done.