Challenge Ideas

[Jarmac]

How about taking over a finnish 3rd league team that has no players on it and gaining promotion to the first league?

[Hypnotist]

Take charge of Bakersfield Condors in the ECHL - the only team without any affiliation.

Utah doen't have any affiliations either. Utah was the team used for the first "Unofficial" challenge last year. I unfortunately haven't had time to organize another unofficial challenge. But the admins have stated their desire to run a challenge out of the NHL.

[bigargon]

now that 10 is done....
what will eleven be like???

I had one idea that i would like to offer up again ...a career opportunity challenge..where you start in a lower level league (such as canadian juniors) and with an eye of getting to the NHL and a stanley cup

[Hypnotist]

...a career opportunity challenge..where you start in a lower level league (such as canadian juniors) and with an eye of getting to the NHL and a stanley cup

Overall, I like the idea, but how would you score/rate it in terms of a TBL challenge?

[Manimal]

...a career opportunity challenge..where you start in a lower level league (such as canadian juniors) and with an eye of getting to the NHL and a stanley cup

Overall, I like the idea, but how would you score/rate it in terms of a TBL challenge?

That looks like too much work. I would love to play in the Canadian Juniors, something I have never done before. I like the idea of everyone starting on the same saved game and having the same attributes for the players(Someone posted that opportunity before and I think it's fair).

Which team? Since I've started to follow the OHL, I'd like to try that one. Maybe take over the legacy of the 'Killer' Brian Kilrea in Ottawa, or Sarnia, who can get the most out of the rights for Stamkos?

[Hypnotist]

That looks like too much work...

That was kind of my point Having run a modified challenge, myself, I can appreciate how much work it can be to not just keep score but make sure the rules modifications aren't broken and are fair. It takes an incredible amount of effort to make challenges work and this would require a completely new set of scoring criteria and rule mods.

[bigargon]

well there are some questions on how to score a career opportunity Challenge. I think it a matter of keeping it simple

something like:

get points for place in divison:
4th place or worse : 1 points
3rd place:2 point
2nd place:3 points
1st place: 5 points

5 points for each round you complete in the playoffs

then a multipler for which league your in
something like:
CHL: x 1
ECHL: x 1.5
AHL 2
NHL: x 4

so you points wouldn't be so much about your goal scoring, PP or pk but rather on winning and getting better jobs, only following league rules.

an example might be:

Your Coaching the Bridgeport Sound Tigers (in your third season of the challenge)

you finish 3rd place = 1 point
complete first round of playoff but get beaten in the second = 5points

place = 1
playoff = 5
AHL multipler x2

total =12 points

so the scoring would be quite simple.
we could start with the same CHL team (we would want Batdad the CHL guru's advice on that) like a moderately successful team, for a good opportunity to get a better job.

[tksolway]

Is there any word as to when Challenge 11 will start. I would also like it to be another NHL challenge.

[bruins72]

Nothing yet. You'll probably see some sort of poll to decide the team before we make any announcement about the next challenge.

[archibalduk]

As promised, the poll for Challenge 11 will give you the choice to vote for either the NHL or the Canadian Juniors. We will then run a further poll with a choice of teams based on whether users voted for the NHL or the juniors.

If we do indeed go for the Canadian Juniors, are there any rules you would like to see added, changed or removed to ensure that the Challenge is as fun, fair and competitive as possible? We'd very much like to hear your views.

[bigargon]

Please this challenge make the rules simpler. less rules

[archibalduk]

Please this challenge make the rules simpler. less rules

We try to make the rules as straightforward as we can. However, we had to introduce more and more rules in an attempt to stop the challenges being about winning the Playoffs every time, regardless of which team we choose. Without the various rules, the challenges would become mundane. It's about getting the balance right between simplicity and competitiveness. What might appeal to you in terms of simplicity is that a junior league challenge might not necessarily involve a budget or a comprehensive home grown / core player system.

[Manimal]

If I'm not mistaken all junior players have the same salary, so there can't be any salary rules. We should have some trade restrictions, I think. Some kind of youth development rule wouldn't be bad. I think only the WHL has a rule regarding the amount of 16-year olds dressed (three). Maybe a games required-rule for them. Something with the foreigners, as well. Perhaps games-required here as well.
I don't know what else, I have never played juniors on EHM, just browsed through the regulations.

[Hypnotist]

@ manimal: I highly doubt much if any of what you suggested will be necessary. The CHL leagues already have a ton of roster rules and restrictions. Plus, you are only going to have total control of a player for 2-3 years (ages 15-18) or 5-6 years tops if they don't get drafted. If they are drafted, you can only hope that the NHL rights holder doesn't pluck them off your roster, which will happen quite often especially if they are a top prospect. They may get loaned back to you, they may not, but you have no control over it. As for trades, they are far less likely to be unbalanced in the CHL as teams try to hold on to their top talent because top talent isn't as plentiful in juniors as it is in the bigs. And someone correct me if I am mistaken, but isn't trading your 1st round pick forbidden in Major Juniors? Thought I read that somewhere. If that is the case, a major chip in the trading game is gone.

Before we go all nuts with restrictions based on playing in the NHL, let's play a challenge in the CHL kind of "as is". If my experience playing in the ECHL Challenge is any indication, keeping a competitive team on the ice is going to be hard enough. It doesn't sound like too many here have a lot of experience playing in the CHL (I know I don't) so I don't think balance and fairness is going to be a major issue for this one. If CHL challenges are continued in the future and people start getting more familiar with the players and or things start getting formulaic (ex. obtaining players A, B & C = Memorial Cup (i.e.Niittymaki, Marleau & Pitkanen in the NHL = Stanley Cup)) then start making it more difficult. But I think most people are going to find this challenge the hardest challenge to date. JMO.

[archibalduk]

Myself and my fellow Mods have the same opinion as yourself, Hypnotist. We have the current rules in place to make the NHL Challenges more challenging. However, the CHL is a completely different league and, for the majority of users, a completely new experience. Thus we don't need to introduce many, if any, new rules because it is probably going to be challenging enough simply by using a different league. As you pointed out, there are already restrictions in place in the CHL and so we shouldn't need to introduce any extra rules.

Thus, I think we can probably drop the following for the CHL challenge:
* TBL player budget
* Core and home grown players

I think, however, we need to keep the draft restrictions (e.g. you have to hold a 1st and 2nd round pick for each draft) because that could still potentially be exploited. Also, we need some sort of no trade period so that the bug in EHM's game engine is not exploited.

I think the first non-NHL Challenge definitely ought to be simple so as not to make things too challenging. If we notice potential exploits then we can introduce rules to address them for future non-NHL Challenges. I think it's important to remember that we've introduced rule after rule for the NHL Challenges in order to prevent users exploiting the game and from being too unrealistic. The rules are not there just for the sake of it - they're present in order to make the Challenges challenging. It has always been an issue that regardless of which NHL team we chose, the majority of users would at least qualify for the Playoffs, if not win them.

Anyway, we're going to keep the rules as minimal as possible and just see what happens...

[Loosie]

Again not sure about the W or the Q, but in the O it's an automatic 1,500/yr for a player.

The only time you will see a player with a higer salary is if they've been signed by an NHL team and then returned to you. So there is absolutley no need for any kind of budget.

As for making the playoffs, with 16 of 20 teams making the playoffs, most users will make the playoffs. The real challenge will be to see how many win the MemCup. Cuase not only do you have to qualify for the playoffs, you have to win the playoffs, and then beat the other champions in the CHL as well.

[Hypnotist]

I think, however, we need to keep the draft restrictions (e.g. you have to hold a 1st and 2nd round pick for each draft) because that could still potentially be exploited. Also, we need some sort of no trade period so that the bug in EHM's game engine is not exploited.

Isn't the 1st rounder off limits anyways? I thought I heard that somewhere. And has anyone tested the bug at the Major Junior level? I tested it at the ECHL level and it was simply not there. ECHL GMs simply didn't give up good players (and believe me I tried!!) Has anyone who has played in the CHL leagues noticed buggy trades?

[batdad]

IN real life 1st rounder can be traded and can be in EHM as well. Our challenges have set some rules out for that in the past and they will stay the same for the challenge unless we do something different.

Yeah...CHL has some silly trades that happen. I got Kenndal McArdle at the beginning of the game for well...a 12th round pick. Yeah right that would have happened... because it was in the early time period. So yeah, there will be something where you can't make a trade from a date in the off season to a date about a month into the season.

Budget--That is what archi is saying loosie. No budget rules needed because well...no one really gets paid!!

And maybe if we pick Portland...most users won't make the playoffs. Cause they are freaking BRUTAL. And their prospects suck too. Ya know where my vote will go when we decide on a poll.

Order to deal with things;;;

1. B72, archi, me: figure out the rules and what we use (likely what I posted and archi posted above)

2. Decide on the teams for the poll (already have a good idea for that, so we shall see)...Think a bunch of really naff real life teams....


ETA: ONe rule issue to add. Lets say we choose a WHL team. Then guys who live in Ontario, Quebec and the other regions cannot play for you. However...it does happen in 2 cases:

a. A player released from OHL or Q...sometimes has signed with Dub teams. This won't be allowed.
b. A player without a birth city...and there are a few in the database...won't be allowed.

I have yet to see one who turns into a star at any level in either of these cases..but gotta keep it real.

[Hypnotist]

Don't know where I heard about the 1st rounder being off limits. The probable rules seems fine, but can't teams sign FAs from outside their protected regions, IRL? Thought they could.

About your McArdle trade: Did McArdle ever play for you? I've seen some trades between AI CHL GMs trading an NHL-bound player's rights for peanuts. This is akin to NHL teams trading upcoming UFAs that they have little chance to sign after the season is over (i.e. the Hartnell/Timonen trade). Better than letting them go for nothing. These things do happen in the CHL too. I remember a flurry of Q teams were tripping over themselves to get Crosby's rights from Rimouski after he was drafted on the off chance that the Pens would return him to juniors (although Rimouski didn't bite).

Personally, I hope the worst team possible is selected but I don't know which teams are good or bad in the long or short run.

[batdad]

No they cannot in real life. But families move in real life, so sometimes it appears that way. There was a case of a WHLer family moving to Michigan from like Wisconsin or Arizona or something last year...kid is now an OHLer. At least as a prospect on the 50 man list.

Yes..McArdle played for me for 1 1/2 years. Original Database. He was turning 20 when he left.

POrtland sucks. Big time, compared to the others. No prospects, no players, no nothing.