General Disappointment

[SkierP20]

Dare to be

You know that it's better that you write your post UNDER the quote so it's less confusing?

Different.

[philou21]

[B. Stinson]

They should almost put the 15 version as a big patch/update instead of making another game full price especially with the shape the 14 is in.

I agree; I know they're young and need the money, but I'd still like to see them do something "special" for FHM 15. I think I've played FHM 2014 for a total of maybe three or four hours. With that kind of play-time, I'm in no hurry to move on and spend more money.

[SkierP20]

They should almost put the 15 version as a big patch/update instead of making another game full price especially with the shape the 14 is in.

I agree; I know they're young and need the money, but I'd still like to see them do something "special" for FHM 15. I think I've played FHM 2014 for a total of maybe three or four hours. With that kind of play-time, I'm in no hurry to move on and spend more money.

Ditto... I almost think that is what you WILL get out of FHM 15 at this point, if it is even released before January 1.

But who knows with the "big announcement" they cant talk about

[SkierP20]

I found this post from Sebastian from 2011... Guess they lost sight of this mission..
---------------
I think that is a very important point: it will be the first version of hopefully a long running franchise. Don't expect every possible feature from every existing hockey/baseball/football game available. The goal for us is to release a rock solid game which serves as the basis for future updates. I don't want to release a game full of half backed features which I have to fix for version two (meaning no time to improve the game).

The project is pretty far concerning features like financial system, league structures, stats, career stats, game engine and we have a pretty good picture of the final product we want to build. After all, it is in development for a few years, we just never went public. The new situation (me joining OOTP, having someone work fulltime on the project who already worked with me before on this project) and the need of finding Researchers made us go public (we did not make any PR, the amount of feedback is just amazing!).

At the moment we rework the project to get it more in line with the new OOTP13 design and add first code we want to share (like the brilliant news- and storyline engine).

We will do our best to get the best possible product out. I myself want to play a hockey manager that is actively developed and available to buy and right now this project is the only option (I don't even need to pay).

[SkierP20]

The big announcement was made last night. The game has been Greenlit. That is what we were all waiting for. It explains all the radio/twitch/podcast PR that they have been doing but I fail to see what it does (if anything) to improve the quality of the game...

[archibalduk]

Hmm seems a bit premature at this stage. Isn't it going to expose the game to more negative comments?

I'd been hoping the big announcement would be something to do with the game's development.

[LAKingsGeek]

The big announcement was made last night. The game has been Greenlit. That is what we were all waiting for. It explains all the radio/twitch/podcast PR that they have been doing but I fail to see what it does (if anything) to improve the quality of the game...

The biggest benefit of the game being greenlit is it can reach a wider audience and perhaps help them bring in more revenue to support future development of the game, maybe hire more coders.

[SkierP20]

The biggest benefit of the game being greenlit is it can reach a wider audience and perhaps help them bring in more revenue to support future development of the game, maybe hire more coders.

No doubt, but here we still sit 5 weeks after the last update with broken contract offers. I tend to agree with Archibalduk.. If you think the OOTP audience has been critical, wait until the Steam folks start paying $40 for the game in the state it is currently in. I too hoped that there would be some major fix on the horizon, and not just an announcement that they are bringing in more money for development. There has been barely a post, yet they are on this interview tour to promote the game. Talk to the people who already own the game!!!

A wider audience might not be the right move at this point.

[coombs14]

I tend to agree with Archibalduk.. If you think the OOTP audience has been critical, wait until the Steam folks start paying $40 for the game in the state it is currently in.

Steam community is not exactly exceptionally supportive for expensive products that under-perform...to put it mildly.

[SkierP20]

Steam community is not exactly exceptionally supportive for expensive products that under-perform...to put it mildly.

Ding ding ding! We have a winner! Pick anything in this general area.. right in here.. anything below the stereo and on this side of the bicentennial glasses. Anything between the ashtrays and the thimbles. Anything in this three inch area that includes the chicklets but not the erasers.

[cyclone]

Steam community is not exactly exceptionally supportive for expensive products that under-perform...to put it mildly.

I was really surprised to see they did this. This might become a real mess.
The problem is the design team thinks they have made a good game that is a few tweeks from great,
while hockey people see it for what it is- a poor effort.

Now on steam..methinks they will find out the hard way- and that could impact the sales of their football game in a year's time...

[SkierP20]

I was really surprised to see they did this. This might become a real mess.
The problem is the design team thinks they have made a good game that is a few tweeks from great,
while hockey people see it for what it is- a poor effort.

Now on steam..methinks they will find out the hard way- and that could impact the sales of their football game in a year's time...

Sebastian once said, " People who don't like something tend to be much louder then people who just enjoy (the game)." and I feel like that is the route that they are taking. The people who are complaining are the minority and there is this sea of users who bought the game and are playing it every day.

Another user said, "It's the height of hubrus how Sebastien talks to this community regardless, essentially having told people almost word for word "if you don't like it, go away". To ask us to greenlight FHM for steam release in my opinion was a monumental mistake. How can I confidently recommend a game that languishes from attention as much this one does?"

I think that nails it..

[B. Stinson]

I tend to agree with Archibalduk.. If you think the OOTP audience has been critical, wait until the Steam folks start paying $40 for the game in the state it is currently in.

Steam community is not exactly exceptionally supportive for expensive products that under-perform...to put it mildly.

This is absolutely true. Not that I condone their behavior, but the Steam Community is not a group you want to disappoint. And it's very easy to do that. Like you say, $40 for FHM in its current state will not go over well.

[Garethw87]

add the state of the product to the lack of communication and you have a war about to start!

[SkierP20]

And the forum has all but grinded to a halt. A few people asked for advice and the posts usually were either answered by the community or sat. Even Jeff has become remarkably less active on the forums. FHM has almost ironically become the ANTI-OOTPB in their handling of the community.

And here we sit.. 46 days since the last update.... And the "maintenance patch" is still on the way...

[SkierP20]

Also, the complaining is heating up again. That should trigger a game update any day now...

[dave1927p]

I think my biggest disappointment with the game is the GUI. Navigating feels way too much like a chore. Luckily the devs realize this and are working on updating that first for the new version.

We sort of witnessed how starting a new franchise in this day is so difficult. I think the devs at ootp learned a lot of lessons they will carry over with their football game. I just hope that in the end it doesn't lead to the demise of FHM because lets face it, it's the only shot at a legit contender to any hockey sim.

Expectations were that it would be similar style to ootp just with less features but it was far from that. I have no doubt that given time these guys can do it. The only problem is will they get that chance. I sincerely hope so.

[SkierP20]

I think my biggest disappointment with the game is the GUI. Navigating feels way too much like a chore. Luckily the devs realize this and are working on updating that first for the new version.

We sort of witnessed how starting a new franchise in this day is so difficult. I think the devs at ootp learned a lot of lessons they will carry over with their football game. I just hope that in the end it doesn't lead to the demise of FHM because lets face it, it's the only shot at a legit contender to any hockey sim.

Expectations were that it would be similar style to ootp just with less features but it was far from that. I have no doubt that given time these guys can do it. The only problem is will they get that chance. I sincerely hope so.

I think one of the biggest issues with how everything went was there was a lot of activity during the BETA portion of the release. The OOTP team apparently wanted that. They asked us for it. Then, when the game dropped in September it was almost in WORSE shape than the last BETA release.. the shutout bug had never been fixed.. and there was a lot that was reported by the community that never seemed to be adjusted. They asked for our help, we provided it. We continued to provide critiques, and things got slower, and worse with communication. So we invested money in the game, we helped, and then got told by the lead developer of all people "If you don't like the game, leave!" Brilliant.

I agree with you 100% about the GUI. One of my biggest frustrations. Of all the code that they could have taken from OOTPB this would have been the one that I would have ported over. They said that they did not want OOTPB for Hockey, but looking around the industry, having a consistent layout across games has worked pretty well for other games, especially the EA franchises as much as I loathe some of their tactics especially when it comes to PC gaming. Having a look and layout similar to another game does not automatically make it identical to another game. Heck, they can say what they want but using the OOTP name automatically markets it to their community whether they like to admit it or not. Personally though one of the biggest issues for me was the fact that they moved away from star ratings for players. Its worked for the last 13 or so years for OOTP, its worked for FM, and FHM started with it, and then said "Nah, lets go to this number and letter rating system."

[SkierP20]

An update came out today stating that this is a large maintenance patch and NOT the match engine patch announcing a release for early next week. So, for argument's sake, this patch took almost 2 months to develop and with obvious fixes from this one as well as the addition of the match engine additions for the next patch, it is reasonable to think that the next patch will be two months down the road as well. This puts us to almost August for the "Final" version of the game to be released.

With the original release talk for FHM 15, that gives them about three months to develop the next version of the game which is only about six weeks more than the average time it took them to develop a patch. Seems a bit aggressive to me, so let's assume that they push that release of FHM back a bit.

Once you get into the calendar year of 2015, so start rubbing up against the OOTP16 release time and Sebastian's little "break" to work on iOOTP. I cannot see the company taking "press" away from its flagship program and since the game is now being marketed to a larger fan base with the addition of STEAM to its audience, the release most likely would be at a relevant time (closer to hockey season). I would not be surprised if they release the match engine fix as this major fix/patch for the game and then announce that because of the FHM14 release they are going to take an entire year and shoot for a fall of 2015 release for the next version. It seems REASONABLE at least...

[RomaGoth]

I've given up on the game at this point. I occasionally check the FHM forums for info (which of course isn't there). I remember how excited I was when testing this game in BETA and researching rosters for them, now I feel ill just thinking about it.

The entire experience has put a bad taste in my mouth, perhaps they will continue to work on the game in the future and release a decent version but I don't have my hopes up at this point.

[SkierP20]

You know, I was looking through some games on Steam that were greenlit or are very early in development and I noticed a pattern with many of them: They actually tell the consumer "hey, this game is in alpha/beta etc so expect it to develop." If FHM had done that from day one, they probably would have been a lot better off... It beats promising "the most complete hockey game ever" which I think is what upsets me more than anything. The community itself and even the dev's have said, "well, what else could you expect from a first generation game?" I can expect what I was told to expect. It's not like there were features that I would have wanted in the game that were omitted.. the features that are THERE don't work.

I know I probably sound like a broken record.. I know I'm pretty much doing this but come on, people.. The lack of addressing the existing supporters of the game, and patting on their own backs because "Hey, guess what, guys!? We've been greenlit!" is enraging. FIX. THE. GAME. Or at least make it as playable as possible.

[nino33]

I know I probably sound like a broken record..

Yes you do!

[Saapas]

I'm not entirely sure this is the right thread to post this but I'll do it anyway. I have the pre-steam version of game, how can I add the game to steam? And not only meaning like shortcut

EDIT: Nevermind this. Found the answer.

[Primis]

This whole thing with FHM has been one giant tutorial on how NOT to develop and release a game. They have basically done every single step wrong. It boggles the mind.

Their ONLY hope would be to release a more-polished newer version and make it free for those who have suffered through he previous versions. And that will never, ever happen because $$$.